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  #136  
Old 11-21-2012, 08:19 PM
Frontman Frontman is offline
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Originally Posted by DonnieDarko View Post
Yeah, he's pissed because he placed his trust in someone and they betrayed it by lying to him. So it makes sense that he'd react like this.
Mark comes across as a very straight forward guy. Probably didn't take into consideration he made a deal with the devil known as Loria.....
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  #137  
Old 11-22-2012, 12:09 AM
Irishsox1 Irishsox1 is offline
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Mark needs to walk up to the mirror and start yelling at the person who chose to sign that contract with Loria and the Marlins.

Of course they lied but the way the deal was so back ended everyone knew he was going to get traded it was either going to be after year 1 or year 2. Mark is set to make $18 M in 2014 and $19 M in 2015.

Here's what Mark just figured out the hard way: Stability is worth more than a couple of million dollars. Second, he's going to get traded at least 1 more time before that contact is up. Guessing Buherle to the Yankees or Dodgers after this year.
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  #138  
Old 11-22-2012, 12:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Irishsox1 View Post
Mark needs to walk up to the mirror and start yelling at the person who chose to sign that contract with Loria and the Marlins.

Of course they lied but the way the deal was so back ended everyone knew he was going to get traded it was either going to be after year 1 or year 2. Mark is set to make $18 M in 2014 and $19 M in 2015.

Here's what Mark just figured out the hard way: Stability is worth more than a couple of million dollars. Second, he's going to get traded at least 1 more time before that contact is up. Guessing Buherle to the Yankees or Dodgers after this year.
Exactly. I won't fault a guy one bit for grabbing as much cash as he can to make sure that himself, his children, and his children's children will never have to work if they don't want to, but there's consequences for every decision you make.

I would have absolutely loved to continue working for the little company I worked for during college. However, I made a conscious decision to leave them for a larger firm that paid me significantly more. Due to that, I no longer have as much latitude to take off whenever I want, do what I want, etc, but I also am paid more to give up these things. You have to pick one.
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  #139  
Old 11-22-2012, 12:50 AM
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  #140  
Old 11-23-2012, 05:27 PM
wassagstdu wassagstdu is offline
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Originally Posted by Nellie_Fox View Post
... If I had his money, I'd probably retire before I'd report.
If Buehrle were to announce his retirement, how long would he have to wait to come out of retirement and sign with the Sox -- or the Cards?
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  #141  
Old 11-23-2012, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by wassagstdu View Post
If Buehrle were to announce his retirement, how long would he have to wait to come out of retirement and sign with the Sox -- or the Cards?
I would think in the absence of an agreement/buyout with Miami he would not be allowed to play for any other team should he try to come back. He can grab lunch with Barry Sanders to see how well that turned out.
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  #142  
Old 11-24-2012, 12:01 AM
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Originally Posted by wassagstdu View Post
If Buehrle were to announce his retirement, how long would he have to wait to come out of retirement and sign with the Sox -- or the Cards?
Not until he got released or the term of his current contract expired.
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  #143  
Old 11-24-2012, 07:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Nellie_Fox View Post
Not until he got released or the term of his current contract expired.
Wait, so say you had a 2 year contract starting in 2013. In 2014 could you just not show up, not get paid, and be a free agent again in 2015 since the term expired?
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  #144  
Old 11-24-2012, 11:55 AM
DSpivack DSpivack is offline
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Originally Posted by Mr. Jinx View Post
Wait, so say you had a 2 year contract starting in 2013. In 2014 could you just not show up, not get paid, and be a free agent again in 2015 since the term expired?
You'd be a free agent, anyway, what's the difference?
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  #145  
Old 11-24-2012, 12:20 PM
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I believe MLB has something along the lines of a "restricted" list which makes it impossible for another team to just step in and sign a player who refuses to report to a new team in a trade.

If said player doesn't report and if the 'holdout' goes long enough, the commissioner can step in and assign another player to complete the trade.

It happened to the Sox once before the 1970 season if memory serves. That's how they got Jerry "Wheat Germ Kid" Janeski.

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  #146  
Old 11-24-2012, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by DSpivack View Post
You'd be a free agent, anyway, what's the difference?
In one case you would play for a team in 2014 you didn't want to play on, in the other case you wouldn't and would just sit at home.
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  #147  
Old 11-24-2012, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Lip Man 1 View Post
I believe MLB has something along the lines of a "restricted" list which makes it impossible for another team to just step in and sign a player who refuses to report to a new team in a trade.

If said player doesn't report and if the 'holdout' goes long enough, the commissioner can step in and assign another player to complete the trade.

It happened to the Sox once before the 1970 season if memory serves. That's how they got Jerry "Wheat Germ Kid" Janeski.

Lip
A minor league pitcher by the name of Billy Farmer didn't want to go to the White Sox for the 1970 season. He sayted in the Boston system, and didn't pitch professionally after 1970, never making it up to the Red Sox. Jerry Janeski that year was the White Sox No. 3 starter, which says more about the 1970 White Sox than it does about Janeski's pitching prowess. Janeski started 35 games for the 1970 Sox, but only started 11 more after he was traded to the Senators, where he was teammates with Curt Flood in 1971. Flood had refused to report to the Phillies who traded him to the Senators after sitting out a year. While the Phillies retained the rights to Flood, Commissioner Bowie Kuhn awarded the Phillies a minor league pitcher and Willie Montanez, who was second in the NL Rookie of the Year vote in 1971. I don't know if "Willie the Phillie" had been the Cardinals top prospect and Flood's heir apparent, but all of that happened a very long time ago. There have strikes and lockouts and many changes to the collective bargaining agreement since.

Teams generally deal with players who refuse to report before it goes to the commissioner. They usually work out out deals themselves, as was the case with Ed Farmer a few years after the Billy Farmer thing. I don't know what protections, if any, the current CBA afford Mark Buehrle. The question isn't simply a matter of contract law, but contract law in the context of the CBA. Still, with Buehrle's contract, I don't know how easy it would be for the Blue Jays to deal him to another team.

Funny, though, that when Buehrle broke in with the Sox in 2000, pitching out of the bullpen, the southpaw ace of the staff was Mike Sirotka. The Blue Jays made a deal for Sirotka, paving the way for Buehrle to become the southpaw ace of the Sox, but Sirotka, of course, never appeared in a regular season game for the Blue Jays.
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  #148  
Old 11-25-2012, 12:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Mr. Jinx View Post
Wait, so say you had a 2 year contract starting in 2013. In 2014 could you just not show up, not get paid, and be a free agent again in 2015 since the term expired?
I obviously don't know the details of Buehrle's contract. It might be that the Jays could demand "specific performance" or else sue for damages. But he doesn't spend the rest of his life in servitude until he fulfills that contract otherwise.
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  #149  
Old 11-25-2012, 10:58 AM
chicagowhitesox1 chicagowhitesox1 is online now
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Originally Posted by TDog View Post
Players sometimes refuse to report after being traded, but it's very rare. The Dodgers traded Jackie Robinson to the Giants, and Robinson decided he would rather retire than play for the Giants. Curt Flood refused to report to the Phillies and sued baseball. The White Sox traded Dick Allen to the Braves for a player to be named later. Allen didn't want to play for the Braves (Chicago media at one point reported that Allen actually could end up the player to be named later), and the Braves swinged a deal with the Phillies. The story goes that Ed Farmer, early in his career, was involved in a three-way deal that sent him to the Yankees and pretty much said he wasn't going to play for the Yankees. Two days after the trade, his contract was sold to the Phillies. Farmer certainly would have refused to play for the Blue Jays, judging from his views on Canada that he has shared during Sox games.

I was surprised to see Buehrle didn't have a no-trade clause in his contract, considering he or his agent or both worked out language in his last White Sox contract that would have made him impossible to trade. And if he didn't have a no-trade clause, I would have expected some sort trade-impediment clause similar to what he had with the Sox.

The money was important enough to the Buehrle family that they agreed to go to Miami. It's easy for fans to see this as a consequence and perhaps even gloat over his situation.

Maybe the Blue Jays will work out a deal with the Cardinals. The problem is that the Blue Jays really don't have any incentive to pick up a portion of Buehrle's contract.
Jackie Robinson would have played for the Giants. He retired months before the trade and didn't make it public due to he promised a young journalist exclusive rights for when he decided to go public. He wrote a letter to the Giants admitting he would love to play for them. He never got along with O'Malley, Campanella or Newcombe either so he woulda loved to beat those three. O'Malley wanted him gone a year earlier but was talked into keeping him. This whole loyalty thing towards Brooklyn was created by his wife.
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  #150  
Old 11-25-2012, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by #1swisher View Post
Bob Nightengale
The #Marlins are letting teams know that virtually everyone is available on trade market, and plenty of teams are calling.

Stanton is staying.
If Giancarlo Stanton were available, should the Sox make an offer for him? If so, what would it take to bring him to the South Side?
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