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  #46  
Old 01-29-2013, 08:29 PM
SoxSpeed22 SoxSpeed22 is offline
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Originally Posted by DSpivack View Post
I thought spending on international talent was also covered under the new CBA?
It is, by the amount that you can pay to sign international players. The worse teams get a higher cap to spend on signing international prospects.
I also agree with Lip that investing in more scouts and better facilities (both domestic and international) are something that the Sox can stand to improve upon. The Rangers were able to stock up on Dominican players thanks to their baseball academies. The Sox may not be able to do the same thing for a while, but I would like to see it. Paddy has done a very good job of cleaning up the mess that Wilder left, but there is still a lot there.
Just a speculation, but I wonder when teams will start investing in African countries.
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  #47  
Old 01-29-2013, 08:47 PM
DonnieDarko DonnieDarko is offline
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Originally Posted by SoxSpeed22 View Post
Just a speculation, but I wonder when teams will start investing in African countries.
I've heard of MLB teams investing in Europe, though I don't know what that's done to the overall talent pool yet. I'm more wondering if/when they'll invest more in Australia. I don't know how baseball profiles there, but I know that there is at least one or two guys in MLB (I think both of them relief pitchers) who played in Australia.

One of them is/was on the Mariners. I forget his name and I don't know if he's still in the league, but still.
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  #48  
Old 01-29-2013, 09:15 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Originally Posted by DonnieDarko View Post
One of them is/was on the Mariners. I forget his name and I don't know if he's still in the league, but still.
I believe you're thinking of Greg Halman who is no longer an active player on account of being dead.
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  #49  
Old 01-29-2013, 09:23 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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List of Aussie born MLB players. No listing for Greg Halman (although I don't know how old this list is)

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/play...?loc=Australia

Lip
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  #50  
Old 01-29-2013, 09:33 PM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
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It would seem to me that if an organization wanted to seek out an untapped area from which to develop talent, that organization would set up academies on the Indian subcontinent, given its massive population and the popularity of cricket. I had a Nepalese student who was a good cricket player. He had never previously held a baseball bat, but the first time we took him for a softball game, he was making solid contact and crushing massive frozen ropes and moon shots.
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  #51  
Old 01-29-2013, 09:41 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lip Man 1 View Post
List of Aussie born MLB players. No listing for Greg Halman (although I don't know how old this list is)

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/play...?loc=Australia

Lip
Oh, Halman is European. From the Netherlands, one of the more baseball-friendly European nations.

The only Australian player I can think of off the top of my head is Grant Balfour
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  #52  
Old 01-29-2013, 11:35 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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Dave Nillson (I think that's the correct spelling) made the All Star team a few times as a catcher / DH for MIlwaukee.

Lip
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  #53  
Old 01-30-2013, 10:43 AM
SoxNation05 SoxNation05 is offline
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Courtney Hawkins came in at #68 on MLB.com's top 100 prospects.

They speak pretty highly on the kid. It's nice having a potential impact position player in the system. Besides Beckham's short stay in the minors I can't think of a solid position player that we have had in the minors. Dayan Viciedo, Brandon Allen and Chris Carter come to mind but I think Hawkins' overall potential trumps theirs.
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  #54  
Old 01-30-2013, 10:46 AM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Originally Posted by SoxNation05 View Post
Courtney Hawkins came in at #68 on MLB.com's top 100 prospects.

They speak pretty highly on the kid. It's nice having a potential impact position player in the system. Besides Beckham's short stay in the minors I can't think of a solid position player that we have had in the minors. Dayan Viciedo, Brandon Allen and Chris Carter come to mind but I think Hawkins' overall potential trumps theirs.
Chris Young was BA's #23 and #12 prospect in baseball in 2006 and 2007 respectively, but that was after the Sox had traded him to Arizona. Hawkins is, without a doubt, the best position prospect the Sox have had since Joe Crede.

EDIT - BA was in the BA Top 100 two consecutive seasons, as well, but I am confident that by the time he reaches Chicago*, Hawkins will have surpassed his pedigree.

* assuming he doesn't get traded
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  #55  
Old 01-30-2013, 02:21 PM
Konerko05 Konerko05 is offline
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Although not drafted by the White Sox, Tyler Flowers was BA's #60 prospect leading into the 2010 season. Not really sure what the White Sox did with his swing after that.
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  #56  
Old 01-30-2013, 03:00 PM
SoxNation05 SoxNation05 is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Chris Young was BA's #23 and #12 prospect in baseball in 2006 and 2007 respectively, but that was after the Sox had traded him to Arizona. Hawkins is, without a doubt, the best position prospect the Sox have had since Joe Crede.

EDIT - BA was in the BA Top 100 two consecutive seasons, as well, but I am confident that by the time he reaches Chicago*, Hawkins will have surpassed his pedigree.

* assuming he doesn't get traded
BA was #51 in '06 and #37 in '05 so you would be correct. Can't believe he was so highly guarded. There was not even a stint where he hit in the ML.

Crede was #94 in '02, #36 in '01 and #96 in '00
Quote:
Originally Posted by Konerko05 View Post
Although not drafted by the White Sox, Tyler Flowers was BA's #60 prospect leading into the 2010 season. Not really sure what the White Sox did with his swing after that.
Flowers got busted of PEDs shortly before the Sox acquired him.
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  #57  
Old 01-30-2013, 03:37 PM
blandman blandman is offline
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So if the person in charge of player development and GM of a baseball team think a player is ready for the major leagues, that's not good enough for you? At the time of Beckham's promotion he was hitting AAA pitching hard and really didn't have anything left to prove.

My point is that every individual player reacts differently to a major league promotion, whether they had 100 at bats in the minors or 1000. To say a player was "rushed" because they aren't hitting in the majors is a knee-jerk statement in my opinion.

It may just be that Beckham isn't a good hitter and no amount of minor league seasoning or major league coaching can change that.
Yes. And I think that's at the heart of what's been wrong about our system. Beckham has obvious issues with his swing that teams were of course going to exploit when they figured it out. My largest concern is that no one in our system - no scout, manager, general manager, director - recognized this and thought to deconstruct his swing. Or worse, they recognized the need for an acquisition and traded away the kids future for a quick fix and then expected him to "adjust" at the major league level with an approach that is exploitable at best. Anyway you cut it though, he was absolutely rushed to the big leagues.
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  #58  
Old 01-30-2013, 03:48 PM
blandman blandman is offline
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Originally Posted by SoxNation05 View Post
Flowers got busted of PEDs shortly before the Sox acquired him.
People always forget this, I'm glad you brought it up. When I hear the expectations from the team, I cringe because I know its based on things he did artificially.
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  #59  
Old 01-30-2013, 03:56 PM
rdivaldi rdivaldi is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
Yes. And I think that's at the heart of what's been wrong about our system. Beckham has obvious issues with his swing that teams were of course going to exploit when they figured it out. My largest concern is that no one in our system - no scout, manager, general manager, director - recognized this and thought to deconstruct his swing. Or worse, they recognized the need for an acquisition and traded away the kids future for a quick fix and then expected him to "adjust" at the major league level with an approach that is exploitable at best. Anyway you cut it though, he was absolutely rushed to the big leagues.
This is all conjecture and hindsight. The only concern about Beckham going into his second year in the majors was about his defense. There was zero talk about possible issues with his swing. Everyone thought he would be able to hit the ball at the major league level after his first successful season. That goes for people in and outside of the organization.
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  #60  
Old 01-30-2013, 04:20 PM
Domeshot17 Domeshot17 is offline
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Originally Posted by rdivaldi View Post
This is all conjecture and hindsight. The only concern about Beckham going into his second year in the majors was about his defense. There was zero talk about possible issues with his swing. Everyone thought he would be able to hit the ball at the major league level after his first successful season. That goes for people in and outside of the organization.
That is only somewhat true. There has been plenty of concern by some since he was drafted that his swing and his hitch issues were going to be exposed by mlb pitching.
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