White Sox Interactive Forums
Sox Clubhouse
 Soxogram: 
Alright, time to see what all these changes will bring... GO SOX!

Welcome
Go Back   White Sox Interactive Forums > Baseball Discussions > Sox Clubhouse
Home Chat Stats Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #46  
Old 04-17-2013, 11:28 AM
TDog TDog is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Modesto, California
Posts: 15,772
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JB98 View Post
The previous manager didn't have a pulse, so, no, he would not have given Paulie the 3-0 green light.

Really, if the Sox could hit just a little bit more they could be competitive in the division. Their record is not good at 6-8, but it's not like they've been getting blown off the field. They had one absolute clunker in Cleveland, but they've been one hit away in several of the other losses.

Tonight, they got that one hit from Viciedo. Overall, Tank is not off to a good start, but he has won two games for the Sox with big hits in the late innings.
I thought Konerko had the green light on 3-0 plenty of times in the Guillen years. In 2011, I remember a win against the Dodgers when Konerko hit a sacrifice fly off of Kuroda on a 3-0 pitch. On other occasions he didn't put the pitch in play or appeared ready to swing. Short of a statement from Konerko that Guillen never have given him the green light on 3-0, and the sacrifice fly aganst the Dodgers would contradict that, I don't see why this is grounds to criticize the former manager.

As for the Sox offense, the Viciedo in the first two games in Toronto is the Viciedo I expected to see this season. If it is closer to what the Sox get out of him this season, the offense might not be in such bad shape.

I thought the Sox would have an improved offense this year, even with the loss of Pierzynski, although Flowers has looked hopeless on this roadtrip. I expected more out of Viciedo. I always expect more out of Dunn because in spirng training he always seems to be changing his approach. I think Konerko will be more dangerous this year,at least more dangerous than he was in the second half last year because he is healthier. I expected Rios to have another strong season. I expected Ramirez to have a better season, and as Ramirez Aprils go, this one hasn't been so bad. I expected Gillaspie to be a good offensive player and expected Beckham would provide more offense at second, which he was before his injury.

The key to the offense, though, seems the consistency at the very top of the order, which didn't feel like a weakness coming into the season. De Aza and Keppinger haven't hit nearly as well as they were expected to. I believe, at least I would like to believe they will come around. At least I hope they do. If they do, I don't believe this team will look so out of it offensifely.
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 04-17-2013, 11:35 AM
hawkjt hawkjt is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 6,880
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TDog View Post
I thought Konerko had the green light on 3-0 plenty of times in the Guillen years. In 2011, I remember a win against the Dodgers when Konerko hit a sacrifice fly off of Kuroda on a 3-0 pitch. On other occasions he didn't put the pitch in play or appeared ready to swing. Short of a statement from Konerko that Guillen never have given him the green light on 3-0, and the sacrifice fly aganst the Dodgers would contradict that, I don't see why this is grounds to criticize the former manager.

As for the Sox offense, the Viciedo in the first two games in Toronto is the Viciedo I expected to see this season. If it is closer to what the Sox get out of him this season, the offense might not be in such bad shape.

I thought the Sox would have an improved offense this year, even with the loss of Pierzynski, although Flowers has looked hopeless on this roadtrip. I expected more out of Viciedo. I always expect more out of Dunn because in spirng training he always seems to be changing his approach. I think Konerko will be more dangerous this year,at least more dangerous than he was in the second half last year because he is healthier. I expected Rios to have another strong season. I expected Ramirez to have a better season, and as Ramirez Aprils go, this one hasn't been so bad. I expected Gillaspie to be a good offensive player and expected Beckham would provide more offense at second, which he was before his injury.

The key to the offense, though, seems the consistency at the very top of the order, which didn't feel like a weakness coming into the season. De Aza and Keppinger haven't hit nearly as well as they were expected to. I believe, at least I would like to believe they will come around. At least I hope they do. If they do, I don't believe this team will look so out of it offensifely.

Exactly. DeAza and Kepp just have not hit their stride at all yet.

Dunn's new approach is a disaster so far. He only has 3 walks? He needs to go back to the old approach of being patient,taking pitches and either walking,striking out or hitting a home run. If he could just match last years numbers I can live with it.

PK,Alexei,Alex,and Gillaspie are fine. Dayan coming alive is huge. Great at bat...might have saved the road trip. Now,go win the last two and get home at .500.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 04-17-2013, 11:55 AM
TDog TDog is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Modesto, California
Posts: 15,772
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FielderJones View Post
I am not a bunt hater like some here, but bunting a guy who's currently hitting .400+ is absolutely the wrong call. I was glad that Robin just let Gillaspie swing away. It didn't work out, but it was the right management decision.
Not bunting with Gillaspie last night didn't keep the White Sox from winning, so the decision to send him up not to bunt prived to be the right call by definition. But he didn't send Gillaspie up to stirke out. His at bat was failed execution. Regardless of his batting average, the minimum you want to see from Gillaspie with the score tied in the top of the ninth and men on first and second is a runner on third with one out.

The reason there was no bunt was probably Konerko running at first, who wasn't pinch run for because Wise was running for Dunn. There was more speed on the bench, but if the inning failed, you don't want to go into extra innings with both Dunn and Konerko out of the lineup. Even a good bunt by Gillaspie could have left a runner at first with one out. Still, Gillaspie actually sacrificed some in Fresno the last couple of years, despite being a pretty good hitter. He seems to be a good bunter. In isolation, I don't think having Gillaspie swing away was a magnificent decision, but it didn't hurt.

This wasn't identical to the slituation in Cleveland. If you only have a runner at second with no one out, you really shouldn't see a bunt. Fundamental baseball is to hit the ball to the right side. With no runner on first, you won't ground into a double play, and the ball might go through for a hit. I have been told that hitters are often told to get the runner over to third, leaving it up to them how they will do it. A sacrifice bunt doesn't hurt your batting average or OPS (a sacrifice fly doesn't affect your batting average, but will lower your OPS). Often, hitters who bunt with a runner on second are doing so on their own.
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 04-17-2013, 01:58 PM
JB98's Avatar
JB98 JB98 is offline
WSI Guru
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Crystal Lake, IL
Posts: 27,029
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TDog View Post
I thought Konerko had the green light on 3-0 plenty of times in the Guillen years. In 2011, I remember a win against the Dodgers when Konerko hit a sacrifice fly off of Kuroda on a 3-0 pitch. On other occasions he didn't put the pitch in play or appeared ready to swing. Short of a statement from Konerko that Guillen never have given him the green light on 3-0, and the sacrifice fly aganst the Dodgers would contradict that, I don't see why this is grounds to criticize the former manager.

As for the Sox offense, the Viciedo in the first two games in Toronto is the Viciedo I expected to see this season. If it is closer to what the Sox get out of him this season, the offense might not be in such bad shape.

I thought the Sox would have an improved offense this year, even with the loss of Pierzynski, although Flowers has looked hopeless on this roadtrip. I expected more out of Viciedo. I always expect more out of Dunn because in spirng training he always seems to be changing his approach. I think Konerko will be more dangerous this year,at least more dangerous than he was in the second half last year because he is healthier. I expected Rios to have another strong season. I expected Ramirez to have a better season, and as Ramirez Aprils go, this one hasn't been so bad. I expected Gillaspie to be a good offensive player and expected Beckham would provide more offense at second, which he was before his injury.

The key to the offense, though, seems the consistency at the very top of the order, which didn't feel like a weakness coming into the season. De Aza and Keppinger haven't hit nearly as well as they were expected to. I believe, at least I would like to believe they will come around. At least I hope they do. If they do, I don't believe this team will look so out of it offensifely.
For his career, Konerko is 10-for-17 with four home runs and 17 RBIs when swinging at a 3-0 pitch. So, on average, he swings 3-0 about once a season.

Guillen might have given him the green light a few times, but not nearly enough. And, yes, I do realize that sometimes a player has the green light and elects not to swing.
__________________
JB's attendance record:
2004: 14-5; 2005: 16-8; 2006: 19-10; 2007: 8-12; 2008: 15-7; 2009: 6-13; 2010: 12-11; 2011: 9-8; 2012: 11-7; 2013: 8-9; 2014: 2-1; Total: 120-91.
Next game: April 26 vs. Tampa Bay

R
ead my new baseball blog: http://thebaseballkid98.blogspot.com/

Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 04-17-2013, 02:28 PM
October26 October26 is offline
WSI Church Elder
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sweet Home Chicago
Posts: 3,548
Blog Entries: 5
Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soxman219 View Post
Sox won 2 out of their last 3 games.

Positivity!
Quote:
Originally Posted by cards press box View Post


Attaboy Tank! That's a White Sox winner!
Quote:
Originally Posted by tstrike2000 View Post
Don't look now, but Viciedo is 4 for his last 8. Nice game tonight.
Quote:
Originally Posted by russ99 View Post
Nice win, good to see Tank produce in an unfavorable count.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TDog View Post
Viciedo went three-for-four Monday night when the Sox actually hit Buehrle pretty well, although they only scored against him int the first...Viciedo surprised me twice, first by running the count full after falling behind and then by driving a 3-2 pitch. It was quite an at bat with the game on the line and different from what I've been seeing from Viciedo coming into Toronto.
Quote:
Originally Posted by asindc View Post
I like the fact that he was patient enough to read the breaking pitch and square up on it with the intent to put it in play, not necessarily to hit it out of the park. Like you said, very good AB by Viciedo, probably his best of the young season so far.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkjt View Post

PK,Alexei,Alex,and Gillaspie are fine. Dayan coming alive is huge. Great at bat...might have saved the road trip. Now,go win the last two and get home at .500.


So nice to read positive messages and love for Viciedo. As President of the Dayan Viciedo Fan Club, I approve these messages.

A couple more comments:

* The catch by Alexei was phenomenal.
* I enjoyed watching the game, especially when they showed shots of the Sox dugout. The players are enthusiastic and appear to be having fun. It is April 17 after all. Anyway, I am hoping to see the Sox go on a long winning streak. GO SOX!
__________________
2014 - Love my compatriots: Adrian, Alexei, Jose, and Dayan;
thanks for the pic, ChiSoxGal85!!!!
October26 - Thank you to the 2005 World Series Champions Chicago White Sox!
October26 - Twenty-SEVEN years ago, I married my husband on October 26. Since that day, we have been blessed with a wonderful family. Then, on October 26, 2005, when the baseball gods bestowed their good fortunes upon us, we saw the White Sox win the World Series. An incredibly talented team of grinders made every Sox fan's dream come true. My family and I celebrated with reckless abandon. And now, we look forward to that day when our White Sox will once again be World Series Champions!
Reply With Quote
  #51  
Old 04-17-2013, 03:34 PM
TDog TDog is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Modesto, California
Posts: 15,772
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JB98 View Post
For his career, Konerko is 10-for-17 with four home runs and 17 RBIs when swinging at a 3-0 pitch. So, on average, he swings 3-0 about once a season.

Guillen might have given him the green light a few times, but not nearly enough. And, yes, I do realize that sometimes a player has the green light and elects not to swing.
On the average, Konerko has put the ball in play on 3-0 about once a season in his career. That doesn't mean he only has the green light an average of once a season. That doesn't take into account the 3-0 pitches he fouled off or the 3-0 pitches he took when he has the green light because they weren't what he was looking for. If he gets hits more than half the time, chances are he isn't swining at many pitcher's pitchers on 3-0 and can be trusted. I consider that more likely than managers guessing right on giving him the green light more than half the time.

I don't know that Guillen often, if ever gave Konerko the take sign on 3-0, especially post 2005. It's possible that Konerko developed into a hitter that was on his own on 3-0 under Guillen and could well be under Ventura. I simply don't know if White Sox managers in the last five years have to give Konerko the green light.

And, with all due respect, throwing out a hypothetical, I don't know that Guillen would have intentionally walked the hitter ahead of Nick Swisher in the ninth with the winning run on third. It never crossed my mind until just now as I found myself wondering why anything good that happens as the White Sox are being managed by their early 1990s third baseman has to be greeted with insistance that it wouldn't have happened when the Whtie Sox were being managed by their early 1990s shortstop.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



Forum Jump




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:37 PM.




Design by: Michelle

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Site-specific editorial/photos Copyright ©2001 - 2008 White Sox Interactive. All rights reserved.