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  #16  
Old 04-24-2013, 05:49 PM
TDog TDog is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lip Man 1 View Post
If by 'salvaged' you mean winning 83 games or so, then I agree with you. If you mean winning the division or wild card and getting to the playoffs? No...

Lip
Because being 2 games behind the Tigers in late April is a hole the White Sox won't be able to dig themselves out of, especially considering how the team has overachieved up to this point?
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  #17  
Old 04-24-2013, 06:00 PM
oldgrouch oldgrouch is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lip Man 1 View Post
If by 'salvaged' you mean winning 83 games or so, then I agree with you. If you mean winning the division or wild card and getting to the playoffs? No...

Lip
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  #18  
Old 04-24-2013, 06:12 PM
amsteel amsteel is offline
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So far this is the team that blew a 3 game lead on Detroit last September not the team of May-July last year.

It's the same team as last year so 85 wins should be its realistic goal, but considering regression from age, the DH black hole, the rest of the teams in the ALC getting better, and the terrible play in April even 0.500 seems unattainable.

Memorial Day is the first real waypoint of the season. That's when I think you can officially count a team out.
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  #19  
Old 04-24-2013, 06:22 PM
blandman blandman is offline
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Originally Posted by TDog View Post
Because being 2 games behind the Tigers in late April is a hole the White Sox won't be able to dig themselves out of, especially considering how the team has overachieved up to this point?
It's not the distance, it's the personnel. This is a 70ish win team and it's played as such. 83 wins would be topping out.
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  #20  
Old 04-24-2013, 06:33 PM
rainbow6 rainbow6 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TDog View Post
Because being 2 games behind the Tigers in late April is a hole the White Sox won't be able to dig themselves out of, especially considering how the team has overachieved up to this point?
Let me be the first to agree with this - yes, 2 games down to the Tigers is a hole this team cannot dig out of. There will be no extended winning streaks with this lineup of outs to bail themselves out of this start.

I would love to be wrong. But I'm not.
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  #21  
Old 04-24-2013, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by amsteel View Post
Only 1 for 2 with that plan.
I'll take .500 ball at this point.
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  #22  
Old 04-24-2013, 06:58 PM
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It's not the distance, it's the personnel. This is a 70ish win team and it's played as such. 83 wins would be topping out.
Essentially you're saying there is no room for improvement.

The personnel isn't as bad as the Sox have played. The White Sox might be in first if the bullpen had performed better,even with De Aza and Keppinger not hitting. I think the bullpen has underached and will do better. I think the team is a lot better offensively than it's played, although for the third season now I believe the team woutl be better offensively if Dunn weren't in the lineup.

It is easy to be pessimistic. You would be right every year from 1960 to 1982 if you threw up your hands and said the Sox don't have the personnel to go anywhere. In 1983, which started not so different from this, you would have been wrong, but Dunn is no Bull. Still, I can't imagine deriving the pleasure that some people do about being correct in their pessimism.

Analysis is one thing. there are things I would like to see the Sox do differently. There areae things I think the Sox could do to improve their lineup. There are things I think Ventura could do to give the Sox a better chance of winning some games, although today he made the right pitching moves. I have no problem with discussion, but too often here I am reminded of Monty Python's argument clinic.

The "we suck" stuff becomes tiresome.
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  #23  
Old 04-24-2013, 07:19 PM
SCCWS SCCWS is offline
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I think the biggest concern is the offense looks like it is going to be really bad. At this point, they have the worst OBP in all of baseball. Individually, only Rios is really producing. He is basically the offense. They have got a nice contribution from Gillaspie and Alexei was hitting well but is quickly dropping. Offensively the 25 man roster has too many below average hitters and it isn't like AAA can come to the rescue. They are going to need outstanding pitching to play .500.
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  #24  
Old 04-24-2013, 07:55 PM
SI1020 SI1020 is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
Stick up for me kufram. If they win about 70 games or so I won't fall out of my chair, but I'd like to think that with Beckham and Tank back, and a continuation of solid pitching the season can be salvaged. I have no playoff hopes and it is kind of funny to me that I'm getting laughed at for being "optimistic."
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  #25  
Old 04-24-2013, 08:09 PM
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FielderJones FielderJones is offline
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Originally Posted by amsteel View Post
Memorial Day is the first real waypoint of the season. That's when I think you can officially count a team out.
Memorial Day, May 30, 1983

Four games under, after being eight games under on May 26.

Apparently that season is worth commemorating, or something, because they're wearing those uniforms on Sundays.
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  #26  
Old 04-24-2013, 08:11 PM
shingo10 shingo10 is offline
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Originally Posted by SI1020 View Post
Stick up for me kufram. If they win about 70 games or so I won't fall out of my chair, but I'd like to think that with Beckham and Tank back, and a continuation of solid pitching the season can be salvaged. I have no playoff hopes and it is kind of funny to me that I'm getting laughed at for being "optimistic."

I've been very negative this season (pissed off about the comatose offseason) but I agree with you to a certain point.

The Sox have shown in the past that when the weather gets nice they can have some sporadic offensive performances that are great. What bothers me is that they seem to follow a 9 run game with a shutout. Until they can get some consistency they will be in trouble.

But to your point its April and I am going to believe the Sox will be in the hunt come September because its depressing to think otherwise.
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  #27  
Old 04-24-2013, 09:32 PM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
It's not the distance, it's the personnel. This is a 70ish win team and it's played as such. 83 wins would be topping out.
I agree-

#1 change is get .100 hitting Dunn out of the line up- he's sucked 9/13 months with the Sox (<.200 from 2011-2013)- and whoever they DH will immediately give them an upgrade on offense- their biggest issue. Then Beckham and Viciedo come back- and the offense goes up another notch.

Do they have the guts and courage to bench or release Dunn?

I wish they did.

I don't think they do.
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  #28  
Old 04-24-2013, 09:58 PM
amsteel amsteel is offline
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Originally Posted by FielderJones View Post
Memorial Day, May 30, 1983

Four games under, after being eight games under on May 26.

Apparently that season is worth commemorating, or something, because they're wearing those uniforms on Sundays.
But how had the team been playing to that point? You can be a lucky bad team at four games under, or a unlucky good team. You can't gain alot of context from just the standings.

Also, I don't think I would consider a team 4 under at Memorial Day 'done'

Last edited by amsteel; 04-24-2013 at 10:23 PM.
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  #29  
Old 04-24-2013, 10:01 PM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
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Hey, guys, keep your chins up. It *could* happen (no matter how unlikely)!

Don't we make fun of another certain fanbase for this type of stuff?
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  #30  
Old 04-24-2013, 10:02 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blandman View Post
It's not the distance, it's the personnel. This is a 70ish win team and it's played as such. 83 wins would be topping out.
83 wins might be good enough to be serious contenders in this division
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