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  #151  
Old 06-24-2013, 10:40 AM
The Immigrant The Immigrant is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
No, you can't. Not if you're starting with nothing like we are. If we were able to trade for high end core players ready to play in the next year or so, then sure. But we've got a total of one guy you could trade for that and none of those players currently in our system.

No team signs an entire team worth of free agents. Not even the Yankees do that.
You keep ****ing that chicken, Munch. This team has starting pitching. It can sign a couple of free agents to shore up the offense and be competitive again next year.
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  #152  
Old 06-24-2013, 10:40 AM
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What is this "5 years away" garbage that keeps popping up? You can rebuild your major league team in 1 year if you spend the money (yes, I know that's not going to happen) and in 3 years pretty easily.
Eh, it's just some people trying to out-pessimist each other, it is what it is.
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  #153  
Old 06-24-2013, 10:41 AM
rdivaldi rdivaldi is offline
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No, you can't. Not if you're starting with nothing like we are.
Hyperbole. We're starting with almost a complete starting 5 and a closer.
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  #154  
Old 06-24-2013, 11:29 AM
blandman blandman is offline
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Hyperbole. We're starting with almost a complete starting 5 and a closer.
We have one starting pitcher, another who won't likely be here or effective in 3 years, and a bunch of guys that would be fifth starters on good teams. I know Quintana's got like a 3.80 era, but he also doesn't have good stuff.
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  #155  
Old 06-24-2013, 11:35 AM
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We have one starting pitcher, another who won't likely be here or effective in 3 years, and a bunch of guys that would be fifth starters on good teams. I know Quintana's got like a 3.80 era, but he also doesn't have good stuff.
You'll have to understand, I'm sure, why people are skeptical of a scouting report coming form a guy who told us (repeatedly) that DLS was going to be a Hall of Famer.

Quintana is one of 3 Sox pitchers in the Top 16 of the AL in WAR. He has thrown 223 innings in the Majors and all his peripherals are better in 2013 than 2012 (some significantly). It is absolutely plausible at this point to see him in the starting rotation of a good team for at least another several years.

Look, I get that it's your shtick to take the extreme negative route no matter what, but you're just going to have to learn to deal with the fact that not everybody sees things the way that you think we all should.
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  #156  
Old 06-24-2013, 11:41 AM
blandman blandman is offline
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You'll have to understand, I'm sure, why people are skeptical of a scouting report coming form a guy who told us (repeatedly) that DLS was going to be a Hall of Famer.

Quintana is one of 3 Sox pitchers in the Top 16 of the AL in WAR. He has thrown 223 innings in the Majors and all his peripherals are better in 2013 than 2012 (some significantly). It is absolutely plausible at this point to see him in the starting rotation of a good team for at least another several years.
Quintana is effective because of deception. Guys like that are effective for a few years. Then, if the stuff isn't there, it gets real easy to read. Quintana's stuff isn't there. And he doesn't have the control of say, a Mark Buehrle, to compensate for it.

One of those three is Peavy, who won't be here. The other is Sale. I seriously don't know where all of these 2015 pitchers are coming from for a championship quality rotation. Unless the goal is to get back to "form" of an 82 win perennial "winner". And then to polishing these turds. Yay. Great plan, guys.
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  #157  
Old 06-24-2013, 12:33 PM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
Quintana is effective because of deception. Guys like that are effective for a few years. Then, if the stuff isn't there, it gets real easy to read. Quintana's stuff isn't there. And he doesn't have the control of say, a Mark Buehrle, to compensate for it.

One of those three is Peavy, who won't be here. The other is Sale. I seriously don't know where all of these 2015 pitchers are coming from for a championship quality rotation. Unless the goal is to get back to "form" of an 82 win perennial "winner". And then to polishing these turds. Yay. Great plan, guys.
What about Santiago? He's pitched like a beast as the starter, although the Sox frequently use him as middle relief fodder.

If it's all deception, they'd catch on quicker than that. It's not like the contenders have 3 number 1 starters.

Last edited by Tragg; 06-24-2013 at 12:45 PM.
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  #158  
Old 06-24-2013, 12:41 PM
TaylorStSox TaylorStSox is offline
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I'm as bad as anybody with the hyperbole, but my god, Munch is on a whole different level.
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I'm not counting this homerun or his 3 RBI from today's game because of the game situation. I'm not counting his pinch hit solo homerun in a blowout win in Colorado. In my book, Crede has 2 less home runs than his statistics show, 4 less RBI, and one less walk (the one where he pinch hit for Uribe after coming in with a 3-0 count and taking one pitch).
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  #159  
Old 06-24-2013, 12:52 PM
SI1020 SI1020 is offline
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Trying to debate Munch is like getting beat in the back of the head with a phone book and the body with a rubber hose at the same time. All right! I admit it! The Sox will never ever be good in any of our lifetimes. Now will you please stop beating me?
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  #160  
Old 06-24-2013, 12:53 PM
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Daver Daver is offline
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I'm as bad as anybody with the hyperbole, but my god, Munch is on a whole different level.
One of the side effects of being the smartest person you know.
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  #161  
Old 06-24-2013, 01:00 PM
rdivaldi rdivaldi is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
Quintana is effective because of deception. Guys like that are effective for a few years. Then, if the stuff isn't there, it gets real easy to read. Quintana's stuff isn't there. And he doesn't have the control of say, a Mark Buehrle, to compensate for it.
I'm not sure what you mean by "deception". Doesn't every starting pitcher use deception? Not to mention, Quintana is very young. Barring injury, he should be able to pitch another 4- 6 years with basically the same "stuff".
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  #162  
Old 06-24-2013, 01:03 PM
rdivaldi rdivaldi is offline
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Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
It's not like the contenders have 3 number 1 starters.
This is very true. Most teams don't have 2 #1 starters either.
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  #163  
Old 06-24-2013, 01:09 PM
TaylorStSox TaylorStSox is offline
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There's nothing wrong with Quintana's stuff. I like both he and Santiago's arms. Neither has a devastating out pitch, but they both throw hard and are learning to pitch. I don't like the screwball, but Santiago misses a lot of bats with it.
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  #164  
Old 06-24-2013, 01:13 PM
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JB98 JB98 is offline
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What is this "5 years away" garbage that keeps popping up? You can rebuild your major league team in 1 year if you spend the money (yes, I know that's not going to happen) and in 3 years pretty easily.
Yeah, the "5 years away" stuff is complete garbage. The Sox have a lot of money coming off the books between now and the end of the 2014 season. It's likely to be painful the rest of this year and likely next, that much is true, but things can change quickly in pro sports.

If the Sox make a couple of astute trades, allocate resources wisely and get anything at all from their minor leagues, they can be a better club by 2015.
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  #165  
Old 06-24-2013, 01:14 PM
Stanley Stanley is offline
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What is this "5 years away" garbage that keeps popping up? You can rebuild your major league team in 1 year if you spend the money (yes, I know that's not going to happen) and in 3 years pretty easily.
You suggesting we go "ALL IN" again?

Throwing money at Adam Dunn is a big part of what got us in this mess in the first place. Since some here seem to think we are set up to be world series bound in the next 2 years, which players in FA are you going to grab?

Scouting and drafting good players is much harder, yet much more effective, at building a consistent winner than just throwing money at bs in free agency. It's clear we've only excelled at one of those so far for quite a while.
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