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  #211  
Old 12-05-2019, 05:06 AM
Grzegorz Grzegorz is offline
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Originally Posted by voodoochile View Post
Rather throw 8/280 at Cole and see if he blinks.
Right; trading Moncada under the scenario presented above is a panic move.
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  #212  
Old 12-05-2019, 08:26 AM
ChiTownTrojan ChiTownTrojan is offline
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Margulas with a very reasonable take on the Wheeler pursuit.

https://www.soxmachine.com/2019/12/0...-zack-wheeler/
  #213  
Old 12-05-2019, 08:39 AM
blurry blurry is offline
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Originally Posted by voodoochile View Post
Rather throw 8/280 at Cole and see if he blinks.
If I'm Hahn, I do it right now. Cole's been meeting with the Yankees who can realistically beat any offer and both the Dodgers/Angels. It's been rumored for a while now he's wanted to play in California and the Angels REALLY need pitching badly. And they're no stranger to handing out massive contracts. Texas and Philly have also been connected but that was reported by Heyman, who is probably the 2nd least trustworthy baseball reporter after Nightengale.
  #214  
Old 12-05-2019, 08:40 AM
blurry blurry is offline
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Originally Posted by ChiTownTrojan View Post
Margulas with a very reasonable take on the Wheeler pursuit.

https://www.soxmachine.com/2019/12/0...-zack-wheeler/
Margulas is easily one of the most reasonable White Sox fans out there IMO.

I still don't want Bumgarner. I really feel like he has too many innings on his arm at his age.
  #215  
Old 12-05-2019, 08:57 AM
kobo kobo is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
Forgetting the fiance story...if you told me the Phillies offered $120 million, I'd have told you we needed to offer $140 million for him to pass that opportunity up.
So you think the Phillies have a brighter future than the Sox?
  #216  
Old 12-05-2019, 09:17 AM
blandman blandman is offline
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Originally Posted by kobo View Post
So you think the Phillies have a brighter future than the Sox?

The Phillies could win the World Series this year.


The Phillies also won't hesitate to sign top tier free agents.


The Phillies will still be in on Cole and Strasburg.


This isn't even a fair comparison.
  #217  
Old 12-05-2019, 09:37 AM
ChiTownTrojan ChiTownTrojan is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
The Phillies could win the World Series this year.
The Phillies were 81-81 last year, I know you value Wheeler highly, but he's not worth the 15-20 wins that would be needed to make them World Series contenders.

Quote:
The Phillies also won't hesitate to sign top tier free agents.
The Sox are going after the exact same players as the Phillies, so this point is moot. Also the Sox have much more room in their payroll now than the Phillies, so I doubt the Phillies are going to be signing many more big ticket FAs.

Quote:
The Phillies will still be in on Cole and Strasburg.
Why in the world would you think that? The point of signing Wheeler is that you can get 75% of the production of those guys (if everything works out perfectly) for a much lower commitment. Same reason the Sox (and 3-4 other teams) were targeting him. The White Sox are more likely to sign one of those guys than the Phillies (though neither is particularly likely).

Quote:
This isn't even a fair comparison.
The Sox and Phillies are in pretty similar situations, with differences being (a) the Phillies are probably a year "ahead" in their rebuilding, (b) the Sox play in an easier division, and (c) the Phillies kind of plateaued this past season (despite their big FA addition), whereas the Sox are on an upward trajectory.
  #218  
Old 12-05-2019, 09:40 AM
asindc asindc is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
The Phillies could win the World Series this year.


The Phillies also won't hesitate to sign top tier free agents.


The Phillies will still be in on Cole and Strasburg.


This isn't even a fair comparison.
Philly won’t even win their division in 2020.
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  #219  
Old 12-05-2019, 09:56 AM
ChiTownTrojan ChiTownTrojan is offline
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Here's a list of the guys projected to be the top FAs at each position in the next couple years.

https://www.mlb.com/news/mlb-free-ag...022-c302396056

Notably, the SP list for next offseason:

Quote:
Starting pitchers: Trevor Bauer, Robbie Ray, James Paxton, Masahiro Tanaka, Jake Arrieta (club option), Marcus Stroman, Jose Quintana
Some of these guys will likely end up signing extensions before then as well.
  #220  
Old 12-05-2019, 10:45 AM
KRS1 KRS1 is offline
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Originally Posted by Grzegorz View Post
They've won nothing. Not WS titles, no success.
Seriously?
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  #221  
Old 12-05-2019, 11:06 AM
blandman blandman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiTownTrojan View Post
The Phillies were 81-81 last year, I know you value Wheeler highly, but he's not worth the 15-20 wins that would be needed to make them World Series contenders.


The Sox are going after the exact same players as the Phillies, so this point is moot. Also the Sox have much more room in their payroll now than the Phillies, so I doubt the Phillies are going to be signing many more big ticket FAs.



Why in the world would you think that? The point of signing Wheeler is that you can get 75% of the production of those guys (if everything works out perfectly) for a much lower commitment. Same reason the Sox (and 3-4 other teams) were targeting him. The White Sox are more likely to sign one of those guys than the Phillies (though neither is particularly likely).



The Sox and Phillies are in pretty similar situations, with differences being (a) the Phillies are probably a year "ahead" in their rebuilding, (b) the Sox play in an easier division, and (c) the Phillies kind of plateaued this past season (despite their big FA addition), whereas the Sox are on an upward trajectory.
The Phillies underperformed in probably the best division in baseball. But they're a really good, built for now team that should be better just on the merits of losing a pretty terrible manager.

I'm just repeating the reports. The Phillies are still going to engage the top two guys even after Wheeler.

I don't think the Sox and Phillies are remotely in the same boat. The Phillies are win now. They've been competitive two straight years in their division, signed their first marquee free agent last offseason, and look to continue the trend this offseason.
  #222  
Old 12-05-2019, 11:32 AM
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DumpJerry DumpJerry is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiTownTrojan View Post
Here's a list of the guys projected to be the top FAs at each position in the next couple years.

https://www.mlb.com/news/mlb-free-ag...022-c302396056

Notably, the SP list for next offseason:



Some of these guys will likely end up signing extensions before then as well.
The Yankees are looking at 60% of their current rotation being FAs after 2020. Not a comforting position to be in.
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  #223  
Old 12-05-2019, 03:31 PM
blurry blurry is offline
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https://twitter.com/jonmorosi/status...389186048?s=19

Any thoughts on Yo****omo Tsutsugo? He's 28 and apparently he can mash (in Japan). https://www.baseball-reference.com/r...d=tsutsu000yos

I don't know anything else about him though.

Edit: LOL at that censorship in the name
  #224  
Old 12-05-2019, 04:40 PM
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Chez Chez is offline
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Originally Posted by blurry View Post
https://twitter.com/jonmorosi/status...389186048?s=19

Any thoughts on Yo****omo Tsutsugo? He's 28 and apparently he can mash (in Japan). https://www.baseball-reference.com/r...d=tsutsu000yos

I don't know anything else about him though.

Edit: LOL at that censorship in the name
I read that he's limited defensively and best suited to DH. Sox have DH and 1B covered. Not sure he's a good fit unless Sox scouts are convinced he can handle RF full-time.
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  #225  
Old 12-05-2019, 05:05 PM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
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Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
The point of signing Rendon would be to move Moncada back to 2B and put out a truly elite lineup every day, not to turn around and flip Moncada for a pitcher.

Moncada, Jimenez, and Robert are the core position players of this rebuild. Kopech, Cease, and now Giolito are the core starting pitchers. Right now, this rebuild delivers a championship if and only if all 6 of those guys become really good MLB players.

Adding a guy like Rendon to a lineup that already includes those 3, plus Grandal, plus TA, plus Abreu would be a great move. It’s certainly better than adding any of the rumored RF targets. In 2021, add Vaughn at 1B and Madrigal as a Swiss army knife to put the finishing touches on a devastating lineup.

At that point, just let Engel play a great defensive CF and do whatever the hell he can do as a #9 hitter. 2020 basically would be his last chance to do something in a White Sox uniform. By that point, hopefully someone emerges from the wreckage that used to be our outfield depth, unless Engel somehow starts smacking the **** out of the ball with all that protection in the lineup and earns the job.

Ideally, 2021 would look something like this:

LF: Eloy (just live with the ridiculousness I guess)

CF: Robert (unless Engel shocks the world)

RF: TBD (unless Robert is playing here)

3B: Rendon

SS: TA (unless he shows that he is not capable)

2B: Moncada (unless he shows that he is not capable)

1B: Vaughn (unless he needs more time in the minors)

C: Grandal

DH: Abreu

Madrigal, backup C, TBD, TBD

This hedges against lots of different bad scenarios, like Vaughn not being ready by 2021, TA not being able to play SS, or someone suffering a devastating injury.
YUCK to Moncada moving back to 2nd base- he's much more valuable at 3rd base- and will hold up better there over time.
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