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  #121  
Old 12-11-2019, 09:26 PM
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voodoochile voodoochile is offline
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Originally Posted by asindc View Post
That's why I said they are both right. Ticket prices are about demand and demand is affected by the perceived quality of players, most of whom receive the largest salaries.
Right, but that's different than saying "higher salaries = higher ticket prices" it's not that simple.
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  #122  
Old 12-11-2019, 10:54 PM
Domeshot17 Domeshot17 is offline
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Rendon to the Angels

The Sox are the definition of Insanity, why every offseason we expect different results I don't know.
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  #123  
Old 12-11-2019, 10:54 PM
MrX MrX is offline
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Heyman reporting Rendon is getting the same deal from the Angels that Strasburg got from the Nats. 7years, $245 million.
  #124  
Old 12-11-2019, 11:09 PM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
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Originally Posted by Domeshot17 View Post
Rendon to the Angels

The Sox are the definition of Insanity, why every offseason we expect different results I don't know.
Almost no one had any of the big three guys to the Sox. Wheeler was tabbed by some and they bid highest. I take little issue with the Sox’ effort.
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  #125  
Old 12-11-2019, 11:15 PM
Domeshot17 Domeshot17 is offline
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Originally Posted by kittle42 View Post
Almost no one had any of the big three guys to the Sox. Wheeler was tabbed by some and they bid highest. I take little issue with the Sox’ effort.
After this long, I don't even give a crap about effort, I don't care if they had a seat at the table, I want some results. After this long, its results time. Grandal isn't a needle mover, he doesn't push us into the playoff picture. The big 4 did

4 teams in mlb history have never had a 100 mil contract. I don't know what makes me more mad, that we are the only one of the 4 not in a tiny market or that we may end up passing one out to some 3rd rate pitcher in a few weeks.
  #126  
Old 12-11-2019, 11:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Domeshot17 View Post
After this long, I don't even give a crap about effort, I don't care if they had a seat at the table, I want some results. After this long, its results time. Grandal isn't a needle mover, he doesn't push us into the playoff picture. The big 4 did

4 teams in mlb history have never had a 100 mil contract. I don't know what makes me more mad, that we are the only one of the 4 not in a tiny market or that we may end up passing one out to some 3rd rate pitcher in a few weeks.
We needed Grandal much more than we needed another infielder. I get the "matter of fact upgrade" he is and you COULD move Moncada to 2B. I'd rather give Madrigal his shot and plan on using that money on this second tier of players who have waited out the big contracts to drive the market.

Regardless, I never wanted him and I'd rather give that money to Yoan if he's as good as I think he is.

I assume we will see money and pitching added via trades, too.
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  #127  
Old 12-11-2019, 11:34 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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The only thing I have seen about Bumgarner is that Arizona offered him 4 years and somewhere in the $70 range. He is rumored to be seeking 9 figures.

Just offer him the 5/$125 that was ear-marked for Wheeler, and defer $25 of it. Then offer Keuchel 3/$60, and defer $21 of it. Don’t leave this offseason without the 2 starting pitchers we admitted to needing before it began.

There is still time to save this thing. 8/$185 with $46 of it deferred is just the cost of securing durable veteran starting pitching in today’s MLB. If we can’t even spring for that, then just forget the whole thing.

Bumgarner: $30/$17.5/$17.5/$17.5/$17.5, 2 club/vesting options at $17.5 ($5 buyout), 3 deferral payments of $5

Keuchel: $15/$12/$12, 2 club/vesting options at $12 ($3 buyout), 5 deferral payments of $3

After 2020, you’re not even at $30 AAV combined for those guys. Can’t make it any more “flexible” or “risk-averse” than that.
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  #128  
Old 12-11-2019, 11:54 PM
KRS1 KRS1 is offline
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Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
The only thing I have seen about Bumgarner is that Arizona offered him 4 years and somewhere in the $70 range. He is rumored to be seeking 9 figures.

Just offer him the 5/$125 that was ear-marked for Wheeler, and defer $25 of it. Then offer Keuchel 3/$60, and defer $21 of it. Don’t leave this offseason without the 2 starting pitchers we admitted to needing before it began.

There is still time to save this thing. 8/$185 with $46 of it deferred is just the cost of securing durable veteran starting pitching in today’s MLB. If we can’t even spring for that, then just forget the whole thing.

Bumgarner: $30/$17.5/$17.5/$17.5/$17.5, 2 club/vesting options at $17.5 ($5 buyout), 3 deferral payments of $5

Keuchel: $15/$12/$12, 2 club/vesting options at $12 ($3 buyout), 5 deferral payments of $3

After 2020, you’re not even at $30 AAV combined for those guys. Can’t make it any more “flexible” or “risk-averse” than that.
Yeah, it's believed to be a bit bigger than that down here, but regardless I think I we have to step in now and swoop in like we got taken last year when our offers got leaked.

Would anyone really care if we just gave Bum the $120 we set aside for Wheeler? It's not really that much and gives you that PR.
  #129  
Old 12-12-2019, 12:14 AM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Originally Posted by KRS1 View Post
Yeah, it's believed to be a bit bigger than that down here, but regardless I think I we have to step in now and swoop in like we got taken last year when our offers got leaked.

Would anyone really care if we just gave Bum the $120 we set aside for Wheeler? It's not really that much and gives you that PR.
There is literally nothing else to spend the money on, unless an extension is in the works for Moncada or Giolito.
  #130  
Old 12-12-2019, 12:52 AM
rdivaldi rdivaldi is offline
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Originally Posted by KRS1 View Post
Would anyone really care if we just gave Bum the $120 we set aside for Wheeler? It's not really that much and gives you that PR.
I like the idea of signing Bumgarner, he's finally healthy after some fluky/dumb injuries. His velocity is back to where it was before his accident and the idea of throwing to the best pitch framer in baseball sounds like something that he'd be smart to consider. Four years is about all I'd be willing to go, I'd be hard pressed to give him five unless a team buyout was possible.
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  #131  
Old 12-12-2019, 12:59 AM
rdivaldi rdivaldi is offline
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Originally Posted by Domeshot17 View Post
Grandal isn't a needle mover
The best defensive catcher in baseball who can also get on base and slug is not a needle mover? I'll take a guess and say all the Sox pitchers are going to disagree with your assessment when Grandal is turning borderline pitches into strikes, especially after suffering through the pitiful receiving skills of Castillo and McCann in 2019.
  #132  
Old 12-12-2019, 03:36 AM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Originally Posted by rdivaldi View Post
I like the idea of signing Bumgarner, he's finally healthy after some fluky/dumb injuries. His velocity is back to where it was before his accident and the idea of throwing to the best pitch framer in baseball sounds like something that he'd be smart to consider. Four years is about all I'd be willing to go, I'd be hard pressed to give him five unless a team buyout was possible.
I would rather be the only team to offer him 5 years and succeed in signing him than stick to 4 years and watch him choose another team. If he is nothing more than a decorated veteran 5th starter by the time 2024 rolls around, then so be it. The window may be on the downswing by then anyway.
  #133  
Old 12-12-2019, 04:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Domeshot17 View Post
Rendon to the Angels

The Sox are the definition of Insanity, why every offseason we expect different results I don't know.

I think the Cole and Rendon deals are doing a better job of defining insanity than anything the White Sox are doing. At least Strasburg is getting a reward after leading the Nationals to the World Series.
  #134  
Old 12-12-2019, 05:01 AM
Grzegorz Grzegorz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Domeshot17 View Post
After this long, I don't even give a crap about effort, I don't care if they had a seat at the table, I want some results. After this long, its results time. Grandal isn't a needle mover, he doesn't push us into the playoff picture. The big 4 did

No one player guarantees any team success.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Domeshot17 View Post
4 teams in mlb history have never had a 100 mil contract. I don't know what makes me more mad, that we are the only one of the 4 not in a tiny market or that we may end up passing one out to some 3rd rate pitcher in a few weeks.
Not in a tiny market but certainly a shrinking one. As for spending one hundred million, why does it have to be on one player? This team has a few needs so spend wisely.
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  #135  
Old 12-12-2019, 08:01 AM
Domeshot17 Domeshot17 is offline
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Originally Posted by rdivaldi View Post
The best defensive catcher in baseball who can also get on base and slug is not a needle mover? I'll take a guess and say all the Sox pitchers are going to disagree with your assessment when Grandal is turning borderline pitches into strikes, especially after suffering through the pitiful receiving skills of Castillo and McCann in 2019.
He isn’t the best defensive catcher in baseball though. He frames really well. His arm isn’t great and he is one of the worst blockers in baseball. He is constantly near or in the top of passed balls. Sorry if he was the best defensive catcher in baseball he would at least have gotten consideration for a gold glove, ever.

I like him, he’s a good player, but he’s a 2 time all star in a pretty long career, he isn’t a put the team on my back and carry them guy. His best attribute may be his leadership which we desperately need. But if he’s the big fish this offseason is a failure.
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