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  #1  
Old 10-08-2019, 10:36 AM
A. Cavatica A. Cavatica is online now
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Default Finding trade value

If the Sox are going to improve via trade, then everyone will be asking for Robert, Kopech, Madrigal, or Vaughn. I assume the Sox would have to be bowled over to deal away a top 100 guy, since they have already penciled each in for many years of production.

They have a few other chips (Stiever, Walker, Sheets, Basabe, etc.) who might be trade bait, but IMO they can't afford to deal away too much of their future depth.

IMO the Sox should be looking to trade a lot of names from the big league roster, instead. For instance:

1. Aaron Bummer. I like him a lot, but selling high on relievers is almost always a good idea.

2. Carlos Rodon. He's seldom healthy and he's going to test free agency, so he is no longer especially useful to the rebuild. He still has enough potential and control to be tradeable.

3. Alex Colome. Unless you think the Sox are winning the Central in 2020, it's time to deal him. Extending him would be unwise.

4. Leury Garcia. Sox should have sold high on him at the trade deadline, but he single-handedly adds a lot of bench depth.

5 (tie). Evan Marshall, Josh Osich, Jace Fry. Again, sell high. I think all three of these guys have peaked.

6. (tie) Adam Engel, Yolmer Sanchez. They give you great defense and just enough with the bat to be playable for stretches, but are best used as reserves/defensive replacements.

7. Carson Fulmer. He's been consistently awful for the Sox, but has pedigree and stuff. There's always some team who thinks they can turn a pitcher like this around. (Of course, they might just wait for the Sox to waive him.)

Thoughts?
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  #2  
Old 10-08-2019, 10:54 AM
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voodoochile voodoochile is offline
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I think that if the Sox want to get a lot of value back they will have to look at younger players like Flores, Stievers, Walker, Sheets to throw into the package.

Possibly some of the 19 YO kids who have flashed well and of course possibly Gonzalez and Rutherford. They also have a few young reliever arms who have flashed well at A and AA this past year who might draw some interest.

I am not advocating for trading those players, I am merely saying I think they would have to go that way if they want to get back serious value. Trading MLB ready players to get back better MLB ready players rarely happens.
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  #3  
Old 10-08-2019, 10:56 AM
HomeFish HomeFish is offline
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Stiever strikes me as the most obvious trade bait in the system. But I would trade anyone in A-ball and frankly I would also trade Madrigal for an absolutely elite pitcher if there was an opportunity to do so. I know to many of you he is the messianic next coming of Nellie Fox you have been waiting for, but there is a serious risk his stuff doesn't translate to the MLB level.
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  #4  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:08 AM
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Fulmer is the one guy on the list I disagree with. He has zero trade value. Teams are going to wait until he gets dumped and someone will probably give him a minor league tryout.
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  #5  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:19 AM
Domeshot17 Domeshot17 is offline
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I think Madrigal is probably worth more to us than to other teams. I suppose you could have teams like the Cubs who would place a super value on a guy like him. A high contact high average low K no power superior defender in the IF would make sense in a lineup of 3 outcome hitters, especially a team lacking a long term solution at the lead off spot. That said I don't know what they have that we would want.

If you look at it this way - we should see 2020 something like this

3b Moncada
SS Anderson
2b Madrigal

OF - Robert and Eloy

C - McCann

Bench - Garcia, Yolmer, Collins (who rotates 5 days a week at DH , 1b and C)

That leaves 1b/DH/OF open

Assume Abreu is back for one of the first 2 spots, that leaves DH/OF open

I would like us to run at Tsutsugo when he is posted. He has some big power potential and could be dangerous in the DH/Corner OF spot. He is risky sure, but he is going to cost 1/2 of what Castellanos or Rendon will cost, and they won't come here.

That should leave a lot of money free to address the rotation and bullpen

I am going all in, every chip I can, on Cole, and trying to round out with a guy like Zach Wheeler

Cole - Gio - Wheeler - Cease - Kopech is a REALLY good 1-5, leaves Lopez to move to the bullpen where he should really be more effective.
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  #6  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:22 AM
ChiSoxNationPres ChiSoxNationPres is offline
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From the MLB roster really only Bummer, Colome and Marshall have value at this point. Moving them in a package that doesn't yield a very quality long term piece doesn't make sense to me, not to mention depleting a pen that already has holes.

I really want to hold on to Stiever as he might actually be MLB ready come Aug and the Sox could really use a guy that doesn't have an injury history, and throws hard with plus secondary stuff that doesn't have control issues. He was found money last year, but his stuff backs up his performance for sure.

I think selling high on Collins makes sense now, if the Sox can land a controllable RF or SP in the package.

Other prospects to look to move for a RF or SP should be Sheets, Basabe, Rutherford, Gonzalez, Adolfo, Pilkington, Bush, Beard, Yolbert Sanchez, and all of the potential closer/back end relievers in the minors.

Not untouchable guys are Walker, Thompson, Dalquist, Lambert.
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  #7  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:23 AM
ChiTownTrojan ChiTownTrojan is offline
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I don't see any of these guys bringing back an impact player. They might be able to use them to bring a starting-caliber RF if they eat salary. But the Sox biggest asset right now is payroll space (lowest projected payroll in the league next year if they don't make any moves). I'd rather they address their holes in free agency and hold onto the few tradable assets they have.
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  #8  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:25 AM
ChiSoxNationPres ChiSoxNationPres is offline
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Castellanos won't get a third of what Rendon will be getting. He would be very affordable to get for DH and rotating with Eloy in LF.
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  #9  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:27 AM
A. Cavatica A. Cavatica is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voodoochile View Post
I think that if the Sox want to get a lot of value back they will have to look at younger players like Flores, Stievers, Walker, Sheets to throw into the package.

Possibly some of the 19 YO kids who have flashed well and of course possibly Gonzalez and Rutherford. They also have a few young reliever arms who have flashed well at A and AA this past year who might draw some interest.

I am not advocating for trading those players, I am merely saying I think they would have to go that way if they want to get back serious value. Trading MLB ready players to get back better MLB ready players rarely happens.
I tend to agree.

I think Bummer has a lot of value right now, more than a prospect like Stiever or Walker, who hasn't reached AA yet -- and certainly more than the ones who have reached AA and then been so-so.

I don't really know how much value Rodon has, but I think he may be worth more to the Sox in a trade than he will as a player.

Colome could be a useful second piece in a trade for a good but overpriced player. He'll fit in any bullpen (as a setup man, if not their closer) and his salary would offset the salary the Sox would be taking on.

I don't think the rest of the major-league names have a lot of value, but if you can get someone to take Evan Marshall instead of Gavin Sheets, that's a wise thing to do.
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  #10  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:28 AM
A. Cavatica A. Cavatica is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiSoxNationPres View Post
Castellanos won't get a third of what Rendon will be getting. He would be very affordable to get for DH and rotating with Eloy in LF.
What does that have to do with the topic? We don't need another fantasy lineup thread.
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  #11  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:29 AM
ChiTownTrojan ChiTownTrojan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiSoxNationPres View Post
From the MLB roster really only Bummer, Colome and Marshall have value at this point. Moving them in a package that doesn't yield a very quality long term piece doesn't make sense to me, not to mention depleting a pen that already has holes.

I really want to hold on to Stiever as he might actually be MLB ready come Aug and the Sox could really use a guy that doesn't have an injury history, and throws hard with plus secondary stuff that doesn't have control issues. He was found money last year, but his stuff backs up his performance for sure.

I think selling high on Collins makes sense now, if the Sox can land a controllable RF or SP in the package.

Other prospects to look to move for a RF or SP should be Sheets, Basabe, Rutherford, Gonzalez, Adolfo, Pilkington, Bush, Beard, Yolbert Sanchez, and all of the potential closer/back end relievers in the minors.

Not untouchable guys are Walker, Thompson, Dalquist, Lambert.
Is Collins really a sell-high? His problems are pretty well known, that he doesn't have a position, and that he strikes out too much, and he can't hit lefties. He has a chance to be a platoon DH, but I don't think many teams are going to pay up for that.

Most of the players you mention are coming off down years.
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  #12  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:30 AM
ChiSoxNationPres ChiSoxNationPres is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A. Cavatica View Post
What does that have to do with the topic? We don't need another fantasy lineup thread.
Was replying to Dome.
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  #13  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:33 AM
A. Cavatica A. Cavatica is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blurry View Post
Fulmer is the one guy on the list I disagree with. He has zero trade value. Teams are going to wait until he gets dumped and someone will probably give him a minor league tryout.
Yes, you're probably right. I can see the other AL Central teams taking up a collection to pay his salary, on condition he continues to play for the Sox.
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  #14  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:41 AM
A. Cavatica A. Cavatica is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiTownTrojan View Post
Is Collins really a sell-high? His problems are pretty well known, that he doesn't have a position, and that he strikes out too much, and he can't hit lefties. He has a chance to be a platoon DH, but I don't think many teams are going to pay up for that.

Most of the players you mention are coming off down years.
We don't have a good sense yet of how well Collins will do. The power/OBP upside potential is still there, even if he can't catch. I think the Sox brass still value him more highly than anyone else.

If you're looking for a bold sell-high candidate, how about Eloy? He looks like he's going to be a middle-of-the-order bat for the remainder of his contract. Could he bring back a #1 starter?
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  #15  
Old 10-08-2019, 11:46 AM
ChiTownTrojan ChiTownTrojan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A. Cavatica View Post
We don't have a good sense yet of how well Collins will do. The power/OBP upside potential is still there, even if he can't catch. I think the Sox brass still value him more highly than anyone else.

If you're looking for a bold sell-high candidate, how about Eloy? He looks like he's going to be a middle-of-the-order bat for the remainder of his contract. Could he bring back a #1 starter?
Sure he could, but then you're opening a hole in the middle of the lineup. It's not easy to find middle-of-the-order bats with Eloy's potential. It's counter-productive, especially when that #1 starter can be had in free agency.
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