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  #61  
Old 07-22-2018, 06:09 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tragg
None of those guys are close to the majors within my 1-2 year timeline and a couple of them aren't good defenders.
There is a solution to this problem: ditch the 1-2 year timeline.
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  #62  
Old 07-22-2018, 07:22 PM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
None of those guys are close to the majors within my 1-2 year timeline and a couple of them aren't good defenders.
So are you saying that the Sox should trade from among their prospect riches at currently at Kannapolis and Winston-Salem, to acquire young major league-ready players?

I’m not criticizing; I’m just trying to understand your preferred strategy.
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  #63  
Old 07-22-2018, 08:29 PM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
There is a solution to this problem: ditch the 1-2 year timeline.
Better solution: ditch the GM.
Why does he need more time than the Astros, Cubs, As, Brewers, Phillies and Braves...especially considering how he completely botched 2014-2016.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
So are you saying that the Sox should trade from among their prospect riches at currently at Kannapolis and Winston-Salem, to acquire young major league-ready players?

I’m not criticizing; I’m just trying to understand your preferred strategy.
Or Birmingham, Charlotte, Chicago. Nothing forced, but if the opportunity arises.
  #64  
Old 07-22-2018, 09:42 PM
Domeshot17 Domeshot17 is offline
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Tragg I might be misreading -

But in one post you seem to say if Hahn trades prospects for major league players, he should be fired, then you turn around and say if he does not turn mid level prospects into major leaguers, he should be fired.

Also, by what time frame are you measuring. Because until the Astros were good, they were ****ing terrible for a long time. Like, between the world series of 2005 and 2015, they were over .500 once bad.

Theo has said numerous times the Cubs were never intended to be that good that fast.

The Braves have done great, but they also broke a ****load of rules to get there.

Not quite sure what the Phillies or Brewers have really accomplished?

It is going to take time to do this right. If we rush these kids we are screwed.

I am fine with what Hahn is doing. I much more concerned with the Job Getz is doing and seeing this kids develop. The Sox are pathetically bad at developing talent.
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  #65  
Old 07-22-2018, 10:48 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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Saw a blurb today that said the Astros continue to have some interest in Jose'. Reported on Friday:

Report: Astros showing interest in White Sox's Jose Abreu, Orioles' Zach Britton. https://t.co/aCJWRicylJ pic.twitter.com/muYQEUTM7o

— theScore (@theScore) July 20, 2018
  #66  
Old 07-23-2018, 04:03 AM
Grzegorz Grzegorz is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
Better solution: ditch the GM.
Why does he need more time than the Astros, Cubs, As, Brewers, Phillies and Braves...especially considering how he completely botched 2014-2016.

Because every organization is different?
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  #67  
Old 07-23-2018, 04:28 AM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Domeshot17 View Post
Tragg I might be misreading -

But in one post you seem to say if Hahn trades prospects for major league players, he should be fired, then you turn around and say if he does not turn mid level prospects into major leaguers, he should be fired.

Also, by what time frame are you measuring. Because until the Astros were good, they were ****ing terrible for a long time. Like, between the world series of 2005 and 2015, they were over .500 once bad.

Theo has said numerous times the Cubs were never intended to be that good that fast.

The Braves have done great, but they also broke a ****load of rules to get there.

Not quite sure what the Phillies or Brewers have really accomplished?

It is going to take time to do this right. If we rush these kids we are screwed.

I am fine with what Hahn is doing. I much more concerned with the Job Getz is doing and seeing this kids develop. The Sox are pathetically bad at developing talent.
Because “HULK MAD NO WIN NOW!”
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  #68  
Old 07-23-2018, 09:24 AM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Domeshot17 View Post
Tragg I might be misreading -

But in one post you seem to say if Hahn trades prospects for major league players, he should be fired, then you turn around and say if he does not turn mid level prospects into major leaguers, he should be fired.
I'm going to edit this down to say:
1)Start getting major league ready prospects (See Brewers and even, yikes, Tigers); of course don't trade for vets: those asinine trades are what caused the need for this rebuild. sox have a lot of good prospects: use them, or trade them; minimize the withering. They need to build a team.
2)I see nothing special out of this rebuild so far. They've done the obvious. At least Getz is new; Drafting and Evaluation remain a challenge. Hostetler is yet another White Sox lifer. Of course don't rush anybody.
3)I measure the Astros when Luhnow took over; they were bad before, true. But if we measure by bad seasons, Hahn' is in year 6 of a rebuild.
4)Brewers, Phillies Braves have competitive teams with a chance to make the playoffs. Isn't that the idea?
5)I can't see giving a GM with his track record of already failing (massively) an unlimited time-frame. The risk of 1995-2010 Pirates and Royals is real.

Last edited by Tragg; 07-23-2018 at 12:54 PM.
  #69  
Old 07-23-2018, 02:00 PM
Harry Chappas Harry Chappas is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
I'm going to edit this down to say:
1)Start getting major league ready prospects (See Brewers and even, yikes, Tigers); of course don't trade for vets: those asinine trades are what caused the need for this rebuild. sox have a lot of good prospects: use them, or trade them; minimize the withering. They need to build a team.
2)I see nothing special out of this rebuild so far. They've done the obvious. At least Getz is new; Drafting and Evaluation remain a challenge. Hostetler is yet another White Sox lifer. Of course don't rush anybody.
3)I measure the Astros when Luhnow took over; they were bad before, true. But if we measure by bad seasons, Hahn' is in year 6 of a rebuild.
4)Brewers, Phillies Braves have competitive teams with a chance to make the playoffs. Isn't that the idea?
5)I can't see giving a GM with his track record of already failing (massively) an unlimited time-frame. The risk of 1995-2010 Pirates and Royals is real.
How is Hahn in year 6 of a rebuild? Didn't it really begin in earnest when they traded Sale, Q, and Eaton? Before that, it was trying to plug holes with washed-up veterans. I'm not saying Hahn didn't have a hand in that, but from what I've heard, those marching orders came from the top.

I'm also not so sure what they've done is obvious...and neither do you. We don't know what other offers he received for say, Quintana. Another GM may have taken another deal that didn't net them potential cornerstone players like Jimenez and Cease.

There have been some pretty big shake-ups in the organization from draft philosophy to player development. It remains to be seen whether Hostetler's drafts pan out but I'm cautiously optimistic. I also like what I've seen in how players are getting developed on the farm (Sheets, Rutherford, etc.) so maybe Getz is the answer. In any case, I think they need to give him until at least '20 - '21 to see if he's assembled a team that can compete at a high level on a yearly basis.
  #70  
Old 07-23-2018, 02:06 PM
hoosiersoxfan hoosiersoxfan is offline
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1.5 years in to the rebuild. Definitely not 6.
  #71  
Old 07-23-2018, 03:34 PM
ChiSoxNationPres ChiSoxNationPres is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoosiersoxfan View Post
1.5 years in to the rebuild. Definitely not 6.
This. Also would like to add that there has been a CLEAR change in draft strategy over the last few years, which has me pretty optimistic for sustainable success.
  #72  
Old 07-23-2018, 05:56 PM
shingo10 shingo10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
I'm going to edit this down to say:
1)Start getting major league ready prospects (See Brewers and even, yikes, Tigers); of course don't trade for vets: those asinine trades are what caused the need for this rebuild. sox have a lot of good prospects: use them, or trade them; minimize the withering. They need to build a team.

Well if you are going to trade prospects the only thing you can net is a "veteran" so that doesn't seem like a sound strategy.
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  #73  
Old 07-23-2018, 07:37 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiSoxNationPres View Post
This. Also would like to add that there has been a CLEAR change in draft strategy over the last few years, which has me pretty optimistic for sustainable success.
Lets hope so, we need it very badly.
  #74  
Old 07-23-2018, 08:08 PM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Drafting strategy hasn't been the problem, at least since the slot system.
High school, college, both - all of that works.
It's scouting, evaluation, projection, development, evaluation again...

Last edited by Tragg; 07-23-2018 at 08:20 PM.
  #75  
Old 07-23-2018, 08:35 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Maybe the Rockies are interested in taking a risk on Avi? Gerardo Parra is giving them nothing in terms of power.
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