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  #31  
Old 07-23-2018, 06:58 AM
kobo kobo is offline
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Originally Posted by shes View Post
If this is the case then I imagine it's just a matter of time. .342/.392/.616 and a K% in single digits in AAA. Even better numbers than his obliteration of AA pitching. No one hits like that and doesn't get called up unless there's some service time garbage going on. I guess it's possible the Sox are having internal discussions about whether or not to pull a Bryant on him. I really hope they don't. Years later, with an MVP and WS ring under his belt, Bryant still talks about his frustrations with that. Why risk pissing off someone like Eloy, who you want to be a cornerstone here for the next decade, to save a few million bucks?
Or maybe, just maybe, the Sox have a development in place with certain metrics that need to be met at every level before a promotion occurs. So even someone like Eloy has to check off all the boxes before being promoted. It would send a message throughout the entire organization that even if you are an immense talent you need to meet all the requirements before being called up. I don't think that's a bad thing.
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  #32  
Old 07-23-2018, 07:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Noneck View Post
I dont buy the clubhouse leader also, maybe for the latin players but not for the whole team.
Why do you not believe that he is a clubhouse leader? Why do you think Abreu is a leader only for the Latin players?
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  #33  
Old 07-23-2018, 08:12 AM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Originally Posted by kobo View Post
Why do you think Abreu is a leader only for the Latin players?

I would think the language problem would make it difficult to be a team leader among all players.
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  #34  
Old 07-23-2018, 08:23 AM
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I dont buy the clubhouse leader also, maybe for the latin players but not for the whole team.

Sox haven't had a real leader in the clubhouse since Drake LaRoche.
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  #35  
Old 07-23-2018, 08:35 AM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kobo View Post
Or maybe, just maybe, the Sox have a development in place with certain metrics that need to be met at every level before a promotion occurs. So even someone like Eloy has to check off all the boxes before being promoted. It would send a message throughout the entire organization that even if you are an immense talent you need to meet all the requirements before being called up. I don't think that's a bad thing.
Agreed. And it might not even be his hitting; maybe they want him to improve his defense. Maybe they want him to be good enough to play center.
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  #36  
Old 07-23-2018, 08:59 AM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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The team is 34-64.
Certainly can't afford to lose a leader off of this juggernaut.
I guess that sounds flippant, but it's true. There is no team to lead, players are floundering; I suspect they'll do no worse without papa.
It's also patronizing as hell to the players.
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  #37  
Old 07-23-2018, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
The team is 34-64.
Certainly can't afford to lose a leader off of this juggernaut.
I guess that sounds flippant, but it's true. There is no team to lead, players are floundering; I suspect they'll do no worse without papa.
It's also patronizing as hell to the players.
What, exactly, is patronizing to the players?
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  #38  
Old 07-23-2018, 09:56 AM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
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Originally Posted by kobo View Post
What, exactly, is patronizing to the players?
Nothing. More spilled milk.
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  #39  
Old 07-23-2018, 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by kobo View Post
What, exactly, is patronizing to the players?
The notion that they need a leader in order to function.
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  #40  
Old 07-23-2018, 10:06 AM
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I guess he is the Missing Puzzle Piece this season. If he broke SP with the team, the Sox would be 97-1 right now (don't want to be overly optimistic that they would run the table through today).

Get his ass up here so we can finish 98-64.
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  #41  
Old 07-23-2018, 10:14 AM
mzh mzh is offline
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Leadership is a real thing, and yes, you need it.

Abreu is the only player on the White Sox roster who's played more than 800 major league games. Think about that for a second.

Baseball is a game of ups and downs, and the psychological does play a big part of it. You need someone who's been there before, plain and simple. And no, coaches can't be all of it. Imagine any workplace environment, much less one with the pressure of professional sports. You're in your early 20s. So is everyone else there. You've been on the job for maybe two or three years, tops. So has everybody else. A third to a half of the office are temps who have only been there for months and probably won't be there after a few more. The only other people with more experience than that are your bosses.

That kind of environment would probably be an unmitigated disaster for any functional workplace. This is one of those situations where the transitive property does apply to the non-entertainment business, I think. Lets be realistic here. Just because they're professionals who are really good at a sport doesn't mean it's patronizing to assume they need leadership. They're human, and young humans, for the most part. Does anybody else think they would have had whatever they were doing for a living totally figured out by themselves at age 22 or 23 or 24? I don't think that's very reasonable to expect, even for these special folks.

That's a bit of a hijack, I guess. As per usual, I think this is a lot of hand wringing because there's nothing else to talk about outside of bad White Sox baseball. Maybe they want to let him come back down to earth at AAA before throwing him into the major league gauntlet. Who knows. He'll be a star or he won't be, but if he isn't, it won't be because they held him back in AAA for an extra month or two.
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  #42  
Old 07-23-2018, 11:05 AM
asindc asindc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mzh View Post
Leadership is a real thing, and yes, you need it.

Abreu is the only player on the White Sox roster who's played more than 800 major league games. Think about that for a second.

Baseball is a game of ups and downs, and the psychological does play a big part of it. You need someone who's been there before, plain and simple. And no, coaches can't be all of it. Imagine any workplace environment, much less one with the pressure of professional sports. You're in your early 20s. So is everyone else there. You've been on the job for maybe two or three years, tops. So has everybody else. A third to a half of the office are temps who have only been there for months and probably won't be there after a few more. The only other people with more experience than that are your bosses.

That kind of environment would probably be an unmitigated disaster for any functional workplace. This is one of those situations where the transitive property does apply to the non-entertainment business, I think. Lets be realistic here. Just because they're professionals who are really good at a sport doesn't mean it's patronizing to assume they need leadership. They're human, and young humans, for the most part. Does anybody else think they would have had whatever they were doing for a living totally figured out by themselves at age 22 or 23 or 24? I don't think that's very reasonable to expect, even for these special folks.

That's a bit of a hijack, I guess. As per usual, I think this is a lot of hand wringing because there's nothing else to talk about outside of bad White Sox baseball. Maybe they want to let him come back down to earth at AAA before throwing him into the major league gauntlet. Who knows. He'll be a star or he won't be, but if he isn't, it won't be because they held him back in AAA for an extra month or two.
Well said on all points.
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  #43  
Old 07-23-2018, 01:57 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mzh View Post
Leadership is a real thing, and yes, you need it.
Agreed. Look at the Astros new book and read the chapters on why they got Carlos Beltran as well as what he actively did in that clubhouse to help teammates and bring them together.

You can't measure it but it is damn important to the success of a club, especially when things get rough on the field.

Last edited by voodoochile; 07-23-2018 at 03:04 PM.
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  #44  
Old 07-23-2018, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
The notion that they need a leader in order to function.
Captains/team leaders are ubiquitous across all sports at all levels of play.
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  #45  
Old 07-23-2018, 03:33 PM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Originally Posted by voodoochile View Post
Captains/team leaders are ubiquitous across all sports at all levels of play.
Of course they are.
But you don't make personnel judgments based on whether someone is a leader...it's based on whether they can play. How many times do we have to hear about how someone is a great leader, or, even worse "good in the clubhouse"...
Leadership is organic.
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