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  #121  
Old 05-15-2019, 08:57 AM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Originally Posted by DrCrawdad View Post
2017 Sox send Robertson, Frazier & Kahnle to the Yankees for Tyler Clippard, Clarkin, Tito Polo & Blake Rutherford. Robertson, Frazier and Kahnle are still contributing on the ML level. All the Sox have left to hope for is Rutherford, who’s hitting .163 BA, .469 OPS.
The problem there was Polo and Clarkin were sitting on Rule 5 and still in the low minors. Aside from Rutherford, the Yankees gave up players that were 50/50 to make their 40 man and would quickly jam up the Sox 40 man. Kahnle had many years of control left and Robertson was still an effective pitcher (Frazier wasn't very good, but he wasn't for most of his career either). Way too many Rule 5 players in these secondary trades.

The Sox can barely fill out a rotation...desperation time is the danger zone with Rick Hahn.

Last edited by Tragg; 05-15-2019 at 09:35 AM.
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  #122  
Old 05-15-2019, 02:09 PM
ChiTownTrojan ChiTownTrojan is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
I don't think either would take a one year commitment from a rebuilding club. They could get that from any number of contenders. We'd essentially need to offer them what they're expecting on the high end in free agency next offseason. Three of four years each, minimum.

I'd say pass to that, but if not them then who? Might as well. Money isn't going to better free agents than that.
I read somewhere in the last couple days (can't remember where - might have been on the Athletic?) that Kimbrall is looking for a long-term deal, but Keuchel would be happy with a one-year deal so he can re-enter FA in the offseason. He would definitely help stabilize this rotation, but my guess is he'd rather be on a contender for more exposure.
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  #123  
Old 05-15-2019, 03:24 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
The problem there was Polo and Clarkin were sitting on Rule 5 and still in the low minors. Aside from Rutherford, the Yankees gave up players that were 50/50 to make their 40 man and would quickly jam up the Sox 40 man. Kahnle had many years of control left and Robertson was still an effective pitcher (Frazier wasn't very good, but he wasn't for most of his career either). Way too many Rule 5 players in these secondary trades.

The Sox can barely fill out a rotation...desperation time is the danger zone with Rick Hahn.
The caliber of prospects took a tumble because the Yankees took on all the salary of all the players sent by the White Sox. Unfortunately, that seemed to be the most important priority in the trade.
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  #124  
Old 05-16-2019, 05:46 PM
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Chris Bassitt: 1.93 ERA, .92 WHIP
Josh Phegley: .835 OPS
Marcus Semien: .770 OPS

Versus

Zack Burdi: 4.91 ERA, 2.09 WHIP pitching in relief in AA ball.

Rick Hahn is that special gift that keeps on giving...to the As, to the Padres, etc.
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  #125  
Old 05-16-2019, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
Chris Bassitt: 1.93 ERA, .92 WHIP
Josh Phegley: .835 OPS
Marcus Semien: .770 OPS

Versus

Zack Burdi: 4.91 ERA, 2.09 WHIP pitching in relief in AA ball.

Rick Hahn is that special gift that keeps on giving...to the As, to the Padres, etc.
Just curious, I show Phegley's OPS as .758 and it's the first year he's been above .600 since 2016 or .700 since 2015. He's a career backup catcher and he's 31 year old.

Semian has a career OPS of .717 and career OPS+ of .98. He's an average ML SS and he's 28.

Chris Bassit has appeared in a grand total of 44 games mixed between starter and reliever in his entire career and he's 30 years old.

You know, just to add some perspective.
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  #126  
Old 05-16-2019, 08:37 PM
asindc asindc is offline
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Originally Posted by voodoochile View Post
Just curious, I show Phegley's OPS as .758 and it's the first year he's been above .600 since 2016 or .700 since 2015. He's a career backup catcher and he's 31 year old.

Semian has a career OPS of .717 and career OPS+ of .98. He's an average ML SS and he's 28.

Chris Bassit has appeared in a grand total of 44 games mixed between starter and reliever in his entire career and he's 30 years old.

You know, just to add some perspective.
Thatís a polite way of putting it.
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  #127  
Old 05-16-2019, 08:43 PM
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Thatís a polite way of putting it.
This thread is here for a reason. People can rant in it. I just find the love for Semian in particular to be kind of silly and none of these guys would have a future with the Sox.
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  #128  
Old 05-17-2019, 09:44 AM
Hitmen77 Hitmen77 is offline
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Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
Chris Bassitt: 1.93 ERA, .92 WHIP
Josh Phegley: .835 OPS
Marcus Semien: .770 OPS

Versus

Zack Burdi: 4.91 ERA, 2.09 WHIP pitching in relief in AA ball.

Rick Hahn is that special gift that keeps on giving...to the As, to the Padres, etc.
Yep, 7.1 IP pitched at AA this year. More than enough sample size to call Burdi a bust. Maybe the Sox should just release him after the June draft guys come aboard.
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  #129  
Old 05-17-2019, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by TomBradley72 View Post
Rutherford is 22 yo and in his first 45 days at AA ball- he deserves some time to adjust to the more advanced level.

The pieces we traded had very limited value- 1 season and 2 months of Robertson, 2 months of Frazier and then Kahnle- if Rutherford has a solid season at AA- I think the trade still looks pretty good.
Yeah, actually he's only played 32 games so far with all the rain outs and off days.

Fun Fact: Blake Rutherford is younger than: Nick Madrigal, Steele Walker, and Jake Burger.
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  #130  
Old 05-17-2019, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Hitmen77 View Post
Yep, 7.1 IP pitched at AA this year. More than enough sample size to call Burdi a bust. Maybe the Sox should just release him after the June draft guys come aboard.
And in his first extended period of pitching after TJS...
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  #131  
Old 05-18-2019, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Hitmen77 View Post
Yep, 7.1 IP pitched at AA this year. More than enough sample size to call Burdi a bust. Maybe the Sox should just release him after the June draft guys come aboard.
My mistake. It was a good trade.
You and Hahn have it right: The Sox need fewer .92 WHIPs, and .800 OPS and more minor league relievers. Hopefully the Sox can find a college reliever for their 2nd round pick, if not the first: that's how you build a baseball team.
And Jeff Samardzija is an elite starter: https://www.mlb.com/video/hahn-on-sa...eal/c-37038671

Last edited by Tragg; 05-18-2019 at 08:52 AM.
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  #132  
Old 05-18-2019, 09:07 AM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
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Iíve said previously that, in hindsight, the Samardzija trade was a bust.

But thatís only because Samardzija wasnít a terribly effective pitcher.

The players we sent in exchange are OK; Semien seems to be the most productive of the bunch, but as of right now and looking ahead to the future, Iíd still rather have Anderson and Moncada on the left side of the infield.

Iím not going to let whether or not Burdi recovers his 102 MPH fastball after TJS affect my assessment of the Samardzija trade.
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  #133  
Old 05-18-2019, 10:46 AM
Hitmen77 Hitmen77 is offline
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Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
My mistake. It was a good trade.
You and Hahn have it right: The Sox need fewer .92 WHIPs, and .800 OPS and more minor league relievers. Hopefully the Sox can find a college reliever for their 2nd round pick, if not the first: that's how you build a baseball team.
And Jeff Samardzija is an elite starter: https://www.mlb.com/video/hahn-on-sa...eal/c-37038671
There you go again, calling other posters Hahn apologists if anyone dares question the "facts" you throw out.

couple of points:
- Those A's players for Burdi wasn't a single trade
- Regardless of whether you hate the trade and subsequent draft pick, 7.1 IP to start the season really doesn't prove anything at all.

You're entitled to your own opinions....and I may very well be not far off from sharing your criticisms of what those transactions have netted us. But, with all due respect and like it or not, I'm entitled to call B.S. when you throw out misleading numbers without being accused of being a Hahn apologist.

Last edited by Hitmen77; 05-18-2019 at 12:30 PM.
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  #134  
Old 05-18-2019, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
I’ve said previously that, in hindsight, the Samardzija trade was a bust.

But that’s only because Samardzija wasn’t a terribly effective pitcher.

The players we sent in exchange are OK; Semien seems to be the most productive of the bunch, but as of right now and looking ahead to the future, I’d still rather have Anderson and Moncada on the left side of the infield.

I’m not going to let whether or not Burdi recovers his 102 MPH fastball after TJS affect my assessment of the Samardzija trade.
The biggest problem I have with the Samadzija trade is that it was part of this team's failed policy of burning through whatever little young talent we had in a vain attempt to "go for broke" and win-now with band-aids....and there's no denying that Hahn was part of that failed way of trying to win.

It can also be argued that the Burdi pick was part of that philosophy - pick a player who looks like he's able to move up to the majors quickly instead of best player still on the board. But, that doesn't mean I'm writing off Burdi either after a few appearances in AA as he moves back up after TJS.

I truly hope that old, failed philosophy is gone. Whether we like it or not, we're stuck with the same top guys at the top (JR, KW, RH) now as before. Not ideal, but this won't change as long as JR is owner.
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  #135  
Old 05-18-2019, 08:52 PM
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And Burdi pitched two scoreless innings tonight and his ERA dropped to 3.86. He did have a WP and a PB which allowed the inherited runner on second to score but also recorded two K.
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