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  #346  
Old 12-08-2019, 04:48 PM
ChiSoxNationPres ChiSoxNationPres is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
Well, we missed out on the only tier two pitcher and everything I read says we're not evening engaging on tier one. So, to me that means we're going to go for tier one of outfield. That's either Castellanos or Ozuna.
"Tier one" for this offseason, not OFers in general. I'm hoping for a needed lefty bat via trade for RF.
  #347  
Old 12-08-2019, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
People did this last year with Tim Anderson and Yoan Moncada all the time. Remember the constant repetition of “TA needs to hit 7th because that’s where he’s more comfortable” despite the fact that he was at the top of the AL batting average leaderboard all season? As for Moncada, people even went so far as to suggest that Moncada’s change of defensive position was somehow a factor in his improved offense.

Can’t have it both ways when I suggest that those plate appearances in the leadoff spot may have been a correctable drag on Heyward’s overall numbers.

Besides, the argument I was refuting with those numbers was the argument that Heyward “has no business on a major league roster.” Even with those awful numbers, it’s nonsense to say that Heyward is not a major league player anymore.
I didn't make that argument about TA. So it's not ME having it both ways.

Edit: but even if I did it's not the same thing as saying, "don't count the AB where TA bats 1st/2nd/5th he's just not comfortable hitting there so we shouldn't consider those AB when evaluating him."

You are manipulating the data, period.
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  #348  
Old 12-08-2019, 04:56 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is online now
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
Fair. He's certainly not a starter though. His defense - which was his only saving grace - now makes him roughly league average. With such a light stick, it's not a given a team would view him as better than organizational depth as a 4th or 5th outfielder. But yes, there are rosters he would make.
Untrue again. Position matters here. He was +7 DRS in RF last year but -3 DRS in CF. The only RF higher than +7 were Bellinger, Judge, Renfroe, Reddick, Betts, and Harper.

Overall, he was +8 OAA combined in RF and CF. Again, a really good number.

His bat is roughly league average, not his glove. 101 wRC+, 98 OPS+ last year, and to avoid getting yelled at again, I didnít take any at-bats out this time.
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  #349  
Old 12-08-2019, 05:01 PM
ChiSoxNationPres ChiSoxNationPres is offline
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You’re watching a different pitcher, then. That’s all I can tell you. Out of 61 ERA qualifiers (162+ IP), Lopez ranks #9 in average fastball velocity but is tied for #27 overall (with 3 other guys) in movement. I’ll try and see if I can find some video of some of the gopher balls he allowed.

Simply put, even when he can throw it for strikes, his 98 mph fastball “plays down” because it doesn’t spin enough.
Batters are too comfortable against him, no deception, his FB is as straight as can be, his slider and change have little room for error - are the main reasons for his inconsistency.

When he isn't locating his off-speed pitches, hitters don't have to worry about those because he hangs them and or they aren't sharp at all. These pitches can be easily hit or identified as a result. Then they sit on his FB that doesn't move, and hitters now don't fear 96-98 mph from pitchers like they did in the not too distant past, because premium velo is so commonplace in the league currently.

No one doubts he's given up gopher balls, it's just that those pitches didn't sink down into a more hittable area of the zone.

Last edited by ChiSoxNationPres; 12-08-2019 at 05:50 PM.
  #350  
Old 12-09-2019, 07:24 AM
Maximo Maximo is offline
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How much does Julio Teheran cost and can he provide 180 decent innings?
  #351  
Old 12-09-2019, 09:45 AM
Hitmen77 Hitmen77 is offline
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Well yeah, the farm isn't as good as it was a year or 2 ago because of players graduating to the majors. It is far less of an issue for the Sox than it is for the Cubs or Red Sox now. The Sox have tons of young players that will be controlled for 4-7 years. Trading young cost controlled MLB guys or good higher level minor league players to restock the farm system with low upside players during a WS window is literally the last thing the Sox should do.

The quality of our farm system over the next few years will depend, in part, on the development of all the HS players we drafted in June. If Dalquist and Thompson turn into legit pitching prospects and players like Beard or Gladley start to look good, things might not be so bad as we fear. Those are huge "ifs", of course.
  #352  
Old 12-09-2019, 10:27 AM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Originally Posted by ChiSoxNationPres View Post

Well yeah, the farm isn't as good as it was a year or 2 ago because of players graduating to the majors. It is far less of an issue for the Sox than it is for the Cubs or Red Sox now. The Sox have tons of young players that will be controlled for 4-7 years. Trading young cost controlled MLB guys or good higher level minor league players to restock the farm system with low upside players during a WS window is literally the last thing the Sox should do.
Also, the Sox haven't shown an ability to build anything better than a bottom quartile farm using regular means. This group was basically from trades of quality veterans who were in their prime signed long term to below market contracts and from top 5 draft picks.
They still won only 72 games last year and that's probably inflated due to games against Tigers/Royals. So if this is the WS window, any trade of prospects for short-term veterans is highly risky because they've shown no ability to regenerate them. Better get productive young players in return. Better yet is to use the FA market.
  #353  
Old 12-09-2019, 10:36 AM
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Merkin predicts two moves by Friday: https://twitter.com/scottmerkin/stat...379756032?s=21

I'm holding out a sliver of hope we're a darkhorse for Cole, Strasburg, and/or Rendon.
  #354  
Old 12-09-2019, 11:58 AM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
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Originally Posted by Maximo View Post
How much does Julio Teheran cost and can he provide 180 decent innings?
He can't.
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  #355  
Old 12-09-2019, 12:43 PM
ChiSoxNationPres ChiSoxNationPres is offline
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Also, the Sox haven't shown an ability to build anything better than a bottom quartile farm using regular means. This group was basically from trades of quality veterans who were in their prime signed long term to below market contracts and from top 5 draft picks.
They still won only 72 games last year and that's probably inflated due to games against Tigers/Royals. So if this is the WS window, any trade of prospects for short-term veterans is highly risky because they've shown no ability to regenerate them. Better get productive young players in return. Better yet is to use the FA market.
The Sox draft strategy has certainly changed in the last 5 years or so, a bit too early to say they can't build it up. I like the kind of players they have recently drafted (baseball players with track records). What about Jonathan Stiever from the bottom quartile? Bernardo Flores? Again, it's too early to know what we have and don't have from that segment from their new draft philosophies.

Wouldn't trading unknowns from the farm then make sense for short term veterans during this window, under your assumption that they can't get quality big league players via the draft?

The amount of wins last year really doesn't matter that much, as CF, RF, DH, 2b, C and 2 starting spots will all be different this year with massively better players.

They will be looking at the FA market, and of course looking at young controllable players. But short term vets, can be extended, and also can be acquired for very little. Quality rental players specifically over the last few years have been able to be acquired for little to nothing. Look at what Castellanos went for at the deadline.
  #356  
Old 12-09-2019, 02:57 PM
soxfan21 soxfan21 is offline
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Just got an update from MLB.com stating that Strasburg is signing back with the Nats. Another big name free agent pitcher gone...
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  #357  
Old 12-09-2019, 02:59 PM
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Alert from MLB At Bat reporting Strasburg is going back to the Nats at something like 7 years, $220M. Sorry, canít link from my phone.

Ho hum...
  #358  
Old 12-09-2019, 03:01 PM
ChiSoxNationPres ChiSoxNationPres is offline
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Originally Posted by BRDSR View Post
Alert from MLB At Bat reporting Strasburg is going back to the Nats at something like 7 years, $220M. Sorry, canít link from my phone.

Ho hum...
Saw that he got $245mil.... wow. Cole might get 9 years
  #359  
Old 12-09-2019, 03:21 PM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
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Not that the Sox were ever getting Stras, or that he was ever not staying in Washington, but there's no way they get Cole. That leaves Bumgarner, and he's really the one guy I circled saying I hope they do not spend the cash on him. I mean, unless he also wants to DH.
  #360  
Old 12-09-2019, 03:50 PM
blandman blandman is offline
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Originally Posted by kittle42 View Post
Not that the Sox were ever getting Stras, or that he was ever not staying in Washington, but there's no way they get Cole. That leaves Bumgarner, and he's really the one guy I circled saying I hope they do not spend the cash on him. I mean, unless he also wants to DH.
If they're not all in on Cole at this point, they don't deserve to win.
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