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  #16  
Old 08-16-2018, 04:14 PM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
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Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post

Late 2018/Early 2019: Eloy, Kopech, Hamilton, Burdi, Stephens, Zavala, Adams, Cordell, Vieira, Guerrero

2020: Cease, Dunning, Basabe, Collins, Lambert, Ruiz, Flores, Call

2021: Robert, Madrigal, Rutherford, Hansen, Adolfo, Gonzalez, Sheets, Medeiros, Johnson, Rivera, Henzman, McClure

2022: Walker, Burger, Pilkington, Curbelo, Steiver, Sosa

2023: Bush?

I think Cease and Collins are closer to a late 2019 call-ups, especially if by some miracle the Sox are playing for something.

But then again, I thought Eloy and Kopech were sure bets to debut as soon as Super Two time expired.

Also, I expect both Robert and Madrigal to play full seasons down in the farm for all of 2019. Assuming their success, there's a good chance we could see them sometime in 2020.
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  #17  
Old 08-16-2018, 04:38 PM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
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Originally Posted by LoveYourSuit View Post
I think Cease and Collins are closer to a late 2019 call-ups, especially if by some miracle the Sox are playing for something.

But then again, I thought Eloy and Kopech were sure bets to debut as soon as Super Two time expired.

Also, I expect both Robert and Madrigal to play full seasons down in the farm for all of 2019. Assuming their success, there's a good chance we could see them sometime in 2020.
Obviously I would love for all those players to force the issue to a more aggressive timeline, as you have described. Iím just trying to keep my expectations modest.
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  #18  
Old 08-16-2018, 05:37 PM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
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Originally Posted by LoveYourSuit View Post
I think Cease and Collins are closer to a late 2019 call-ups, especially if by some miracle the Sox are playing for something.

But then again, I thought Eloy and Kopech were sure bets to debut as soon as Super Two time expired.

Also, I expect both Robert and Madrigal to play full seasons down in the farm for all of 2019. Assuming their success, there's a good chance we could see them sometime in 2020.
Especially Cease- the way he's dominating at AA, I'm sure he'll start 2019 at AAA- he could be up by the All Star break.
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  #19  
Old 08-16-2018, 05:56 PM
DonnieDarko DonnieDarko is offline
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Originally Posted by TomBradley72 View Post
Especially Cease- the way he's dominating at AA, I'm sure he'll start 2019 at AAA- he could be up by the All Star break.
To me it seems increasingly apparent that Hahn is going to pull service time shenanigans with Kopech and Jimenez. With the way that Cease has been performing, I don't see a reason why Hahn would do any differently with him. Ergo, I see first few weeks of 2020 as a much more realistic arrival date.
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  #20  
Old 08-16-2018, 06:48 PM
mzh mzh is offline
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Originally Posted by DonnieDarko View Post
To me it seems increasingly apparent that Hahn is going to pull service time shenanigans with Kopech and Jimenez. With the way that Cease has been performing, I don't see a reason why Hahn would do any differently with him. Ergo, I see first few weeks of 2020 as a much more realistic arrival date.
With Cease, I think it would depend on how he plays. Kopech you could justify keeping down because he was still running an ERA above 4 as late as the end of July, and Eloy because he started the year in AA. If Cease starts the year and AAA and performs something close to what he's done this year, I think they'd be pushing it into grievance territory by having him start the next year in the minors too.
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  #21  
Old 08-16-2018, 06:49 PM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomBradley72 View Post
Especially Cease- the way he's dominating at AA, I'm sure he'll start 2019 at AAA- he could be up by the All Star break.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonnieDarko View Post
To me it seems increasingly apparent that Hahn is going to pull service time shenanigans with Kopech and Jimenez. With the way that Cease has been performing, I don't see a reason why Hahn would do any differently with him. Ergo, I see first few weeks of 2020 as a much more realistic arrival date.
Cease is still building his stamina with regards to innings. A full season between A+ and AA this year, followed by a full 2019 at Charlotte, is perfectly acceptable.
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  #22  
Old 08-16-2018, 07:26 PM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
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Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
Cease is still building his stamina with regards to innings. A full season between A+ and AA this year, followed by a full 2019 at Charlotte, is perfectly acceptable.
I don't think teams see it this way anymore with young pitching. Once they dominate in AA or AAA they are ready to go.

There's just X amount of bullets in every arm, teams need to get those as early as they can.
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  #23  
Old 08-16-2018, 07:35 PM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonnieDarko View Post
To me it seems increasingly apparent that Hahn is going to pull service time shenanigans with Kopech and Jimenez. With the way that Cease has been performing, I don't see a reason why Hahn would do any differently with him. Ergo, I see first few weeks of 2020 as a much more realistic arrival date.
The problem I see with that approach(and God hope that's not what they are doing) is that you don't allow for the window to open up on contending soon enough to be able to use the entire group as a whole for a 4-5 solid year run. That's what the Cubs are doing right now, taking advantage of a young core as as a whole for this being their 4th year.

I hope the Sox learned from the early 90s of what it's like for your Core not to come together as a whole until very late in the process.
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  #24  
Old 08-16-2018, 07:45 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveYourSuit
The problem I see with that approach(and God hope that's not what they are doing) is that you don't allow for the window to open up on contending soon enough to be able to use the entire group as a whole for a 4-5 solid year run. That's what the Cubs are doing right now, taking advantage of a young core as as a whole for this being their 4th year.

I hope the Sox learned from the early 90s of what it's like for your Core not to come together as a whole until very late in the process.
Itís still preferable to this teamís oft-repeated mistake of rushing prospects to the majors prematurely.

2 or 3 years with most players at their best due to proper development is better than 4 or 5 years with several players being promoted prematurely. If some kids need more time, then utilize free agency to buy that time.
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  #25  
Old 08-16-2018, 08:57 PM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
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Anyone still think Kopech isn't ready?

6 IP; 1 ER; 0BB; 9Ks
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  #26  
Old 08-16-2018, 09:45 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveYourSuit
Anyone still think Kopech isn't ready?

6 IP; 1 ER; 0BB; 9Ks
An even better question would be: Was his rough patch simply a matter of a young person struggling to deal with grief?
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  #27  
Old 08-16-2018, 09:49 PM
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voodoochile voodoochile is offline
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Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
An even better question would be: Was his rough patch simply a matter of a young person struggling to deal with grief?
Looks that way or maybe it was that and just a natural letdown that will happen from time to time with young players.
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  #28  
Old 08-16-2018, 10:17 PM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonnieDarko View Post
To me it seems increasingly apparent that Hahn is going to pull service time shenanigans with Kopech and Jimenez. With the way that Cease has been performing, I don't see a reason why Hahn would do any differently with him. Ergo, I see first few weeks of 2020 as a much more realistic arrival date.
Could be- but if Cease is dominating AAA in April/May like he has AA the past 2 months- what's the point of waiting all the way to April, 2020 to bring him up? Does it really make sense to waste 3-4 months of his talent at AAA in 2019, when the team is improving thanks to Kopech and Jimenez?

If he's ready- a rotation of Rodon, Kopech, Lopez, Cease, Giolito would have the Sox on a very positive trajectory (along with the young arms arriving in the pen, Jimenez, etc,)- at some point getting the initial growing pains/league adjusting phase out of the way is important- and I think the Sox should be targeting 2020 for contention- with Madrigal, Robert and Collins entering the mix.
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  #29  
Old 08-16-2018, 10:26 PM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
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Originally Posted by LoveYourSuit View Post
Anyone still think Kopech isn't ready?

6 IP; 1 ER; 0BB; 9Ks
Kopech's last 10 games-

3-2, 2.14 ERA, 82 Ks, 14 BBs in 59 IP

Holy **** is this guy ready.
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  #30  
Old 08-16-2018, 10:46 PM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
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Originally Posted by TomBradley72 View Post
Kopech's last 10 games-

3-2, 2.14 ERA, 82 Ks, 14 BBs in 59 IP

Holy **** is this guy ready.

His numbers along with Eloy you can't hide much longer.

It's complete hypocrisy to tell the media "Some guys will force the issue" and continue to turn a blind eye with this. Especially when you promoted 4 guys last Summer who were not even close to performing at this elite pace.

This sends a bad message to the rest of the farm if both these guys are not here by the end of this month. Put the finances to the side, do what's right here.
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