*Official* 9-19 Cy Chen blanks bats; KC 3 SOX 0 Postgamer

[Nellie_Fox]

Originally Posted by Hitmen77

Actually, it looks like the color was added to the quote in the reply.

Right you are. I didn't click enough "go back to original" buttons on quotes. Sorry Brian.

[Noneck]

Originally Posted by Nellie_Fox

And done by a mod.

Brians post was altered, you dunced the wrong guy.

[wassagstdu]

Originally Posted by doublem23

The White Sox rank 4th (they did last night and still do today) in the AL in RUNS PER GAME, which is the more useful of the two. Boston has scored 8 more runs than the White Sox have. They've also played 2 more games. Put 2 and 2 together, hombre.

And I use the league rank because it shows the number outside of a vaccuum, what good does it do to show just the raw number with no context of league averages? The league average in runs per game is down almost a 1/2 run since just the mid '00s.

REALLY. ****ING. SIMPLE*.

*requires basic understanding of math

If you think the few numbers you cited provide any evidence of your contention that Manto has had a significant effect on Sox run production then you need some basic understanding of statistics. Using league average carries an implicit assumption about the causes of the decrease in runs, namely that they affect all teams equally -- or that they affect the Sox equally with the rest of the league. How much is due to new parks or to other teams decreasing PED use (which of course was always zero for the Sox)? But even accepting all of your points, I still stand by my conclusion. There is no evidence that Greg Walker was the problem, or that Jeff Manto provides any more solution. Maybe Manto helped Dunn, but Rios' turnaround is likely due mainly to (a) moving to right field, and (b) a more upright stance (which Walker helped him with).

Now if we have players praising Manto like D Wise praised the Yankees' hitting coach then I would have no problem accepting your hypothesis. But I haven't seen it.

[doublem23]

Originally Posted by wassagstdu

Now if we have players praising Manto like D Wise praised the Yankees' hitting coach then I would have no problem accepting your hypothesis. But I haven't seen it.

Dunn came out very early in the year praising Manto's approach and how it helped him regain form

[gosox41]

Originally Posted by doublem23

By the way, if I read one more of these DUHHHHHHHH, WHAT HAS MANTO DONE THAT WALKER HASN'T posts, I am going to go nuts. Here's what he's done, mother****ers:

Sox rank in AL in RPG:

2012 - 4th
2011 - 11th
2010 - 7th
2009 - 12th

NOT. ROCKET. SCIENCE.

Neither is it rocker science to see that during the month of September, we probably rank lower. I don't have the stats, but I've seen enough bad baseball to know that the September production of this team has dropped.

And last I checked we're still playing for something, so it might be a good time to not lose 4 of 6 to a team that's 15 games under .500 mostly due to poor offense....oh wait a second.



Bob

[gosox41]

Originally Posted by Lip Man 1

To me and I'm not a stat guy, runs per game is misleading.

In the early part of the new century the Sox had a number of high scoring games and season totals...yet they also had a bunch of games and streaks where they'd get eight runs in a game then the next day one.

That still averages out to 4 1/2 runs a game.

This year for example, they have been shutout now 11 times. Also they have been held to three runs or less in 59 games out of 148 played.

40%.

Just sayin'

Lip

To paraphrase Hawk, don't tell me how much they score, but when they score them.

It's September and we have a 2 game lead. Now would be a good time to score them, that is unless you like ending your baseball season on a sour note. And to hopefully not start off on a tangent, yes the Sox have exceed expectations. But when you have a 3 game lead with 16 left, it still hurts to blow it. But if people here want to rationalize it away, feel free.

I agree with Thibs: "Do. Your. Job."


Bob

[gosox41]

Originally Posted by SCCWS

That would lead one to conclude, Manto turned the offense around this year. But Greg Walker goes to Atlanta and their RPG went from 10th to 5th.
My conclusion---hitting coach is not that influential or change just brought improvemnet to both teams.

I can see Beckham needing more help from a hitting coach then Dunn or Rios. Wasn't Walker saying last year that Rios needed to adjust his hands. Maybe he didn't say it in a nice enough tone. Wasn't part of Dunn's woes due to a sick child. Maybe Manto whispered sweet nothings into Rios ear, or maybe Rios had some sort of much needed attitude adjustment and realized he needs to be more coachable.

Keep in mind I'm no advocating for Walker. But the new boss seems to be pretty similar to the old boss.


Bob