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  #1  
Old 04-21-2019, 04:03 PM
thomas35forever's Avatar
thomas35forever thomas35forever is offline
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The eighth inning was fun, but the rest of the game was blah. Spent a lot of it with a book and the game on in the background.
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  #2  
Old 04-21-2019, 04:11 PM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
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For the sake of keeping Eloy in one piece, the Sox better find a way to vacate DH ASAP or else this guy is going to get hurt in the OF and ruin whatever offensive career was projected on him.

And the whole offensive thing is another deal altogether. This guy is so screwed up on off-speed pitches it's a rough watch right now.
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  #3  
Old 04-21-2019, 04:13 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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So much for this "easy" stretch that some here were projecting for this club.
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  #4  
Old 04-21-2019, 04:15 PM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Yonder Alonso embodies everything about the Hahn regime.
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  #5  
Old 04-21-2019, 04:22 PM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
Yonder Alonso embodies everything about the Hahn regime.
I'd be interested to see a full list of all the Hahn veteran acquisitions. Started by the Keppinger fiasco.

It's not a good resume.

With that said, he'll have a job for life with JR Co.
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  #6  
Old 04-21-2019, 04:23 PM
LITTLE NELL LITTLE NELL is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
Yonder Alonso embodies everything about the Hahn regime.
He and Abreu are killing us as the 3 and 4 guys in the lineup, Eloy needs to step it up also.
You can't expect Yoan and Timmy to carry the team everyday.
On to Baltimore and maybe we can best those guys.
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Last edited by LITTLE NELL; 04-21-2019 at 05:06 PM.
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  #7  
Old 04-21-2019, 04:26 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Lopez only had two pitches working today. When his changeup abandons him like it did today, itís going to be an uphill climb. He showed some mettle battling through it, which was nice to see.

Meanwhile, there were some flat-out embarrassing at-bats against Norris today. Add a dash of bad defense, and presto!
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  #8  
Old 04-21-2019, 04:57 PM
Dick Allen Dick Allen is offline
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Didnít see the game but just looked at the box score. This Ruiz, with an ERA over 11, allowed a HR to Beckham? DFA his ugly ass.
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  #9  
Old 04-21-2019, 05:07 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Easter Fun Fact: Gordon Beckham has a .939 OPS!
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  #10  
Old 04-21-2019, 06:05 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveYourSuit View Post
I'd be interested to see a full list of all the Hahn veteran acquisitions.With that said, he'll have a job for life with JR Co.
Here you go (these are just the free agent signings but it will give you an idea of how bad it has been)

2012-13
Dewayne Wise
Jeff Keppinger
Tony Pena
Matt Lindstrom
2013-14
Jose Abreu
Zack Putnam
Felipe Paulino
Ronald Belisario
Scott Downs
Dylan Axelrod
Brian Omogrosso
2014-15
Junior Guerra
Zack Duke
Adam LaRoche
David Robertson
Melky Cabrera
Brad Penny
Emilio Bonifacio
Geovany Soto
Scott Carroll
Jesse Crain
Gordon Beckham
Nicky Delmonico
Matt Albers
2015-16
Matt Purke
Alex Avila
Dioner Navarro
Jacob Turner
Matt Albers
Mat Latos
Jimmy Rollins
Austin Jackson
Chris Volstad
2016-17
Derek Holland
Cody Asche
Everth Cabrera
Geovany Soto
Gregory Infante
Anthony Swarzak
Peter Bourjas
2017-18
Matt Skole
Welington Castillo
Miguel Gonzalez
Chris Volstad
Xavier Cedeno
Jeanmar Gomez
Bruce Rondon
Hector Santiago
2018-19
James McCann
Kelvin Herrerra
Jon Jay

I saw where at another site someone calculated the WAR ratings for each one of these players while with the Sox and over 50% of the time, the rating WAS IN THE NEGATIVE!

And some of these guys, Hahn signed TWICE! The calculation was over 250 million dollars spent on these guys. Basically money flushed right down the toilet for the vast majority of them.

In my opinion the only ones who actually did well with the Sox you can name on one hand...Abreu, Putnam (when healthy which wasn't often), Robertson, Crain, Swarzak. That's all. That's absolutely horrific for a GM.

Last edited by Lip Man 1; 04-21-2019 at 06:16 PM.
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  #11  
Old 04-21-2019, 06:17 PM
LITTLE NELL LITTLE NELL is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lip Man 1 View Post
Here you go (these are just the free agent signings but it will give you an idea of how bad it has been)

2012-13
Dewayne Wise
Jeff Keppinger
Tony Pena
Matt Lindstrom
2013-14
Jose Abreu
Zack Putnam
Felipe Paulino
Ronald Belisario
Scott Downs
Dylan Axelrod
Brian Omogrosso
2014-15
Junior Guerra
Zack Duke
Adam LaRoche
David Robertson
Melky Cabrera
Brad Penny
Emilio Bonifacio
Geovany Soto
Scott Carroll
Jesse Crain
Gordon Beckham
Nicky Delmonico
Matt Albers
2015-16
Matt Purke
Alex Avila
Dioner Navarro
Jacob Turner
Matt Albers
Mat Latos
Jimmy Rollins
Austin Jackson
Chris Volstad
2016-17
Derek Holland
Cody Asche
Everth Cabrera
Geovany Soto
Gregory Infante
Anthony Swarzak
Peter Bourjas
2017-18
Matt Skole
Welington Castillo
Miguel Gonzalez
Chris Volstad
Xavier Cedeno
Jeanmar Gomez
Bruce Rondon
Hector Santiago
2018-19
James McCann
Kelvin Herrerra
Jon Jay

I saw where at another site someone calculated the WAR ratings for each one of these players while with the Sox and over 50% of the time, the rating WAS IN THE NEGATIVE!

And some of these guys, Hahn signed TWICE! The calculation was over 250 million dollars spent on these guys. Basically money flushed right down the toilet for the vast majority of them.
Holy crap Batman, that is one pathetic list, had no idea we spent so much on so little.
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  #12  
Old 04-21-2019, 07:18 PM
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Brian26 Brian26 is offline
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Just trying to be level-headed about that list, because it looks awful, but some things to point out:

Many of the names on the list were signed for relative peanuts (in MLB terms at least).

The big names that have been signed generally performed admirably. Abreu, you could argue, was worth well more than what he signed for and probably has been worth about twice for what he actually signed for (which would be close to half of that $250M). Robertson and Melky did fine, and Rutherford might end up worth the eventual trade of Robertson and Frazier.

The biggest point though is to consider league-wide free agent signings aren't as prolific as they once were. Many talented players are signed and extended early. I don't feel like doing the homework now, but I would guess if you were to look at a list of FA signings for every team in baseball, the lists would look similar: 90% filler with back of the rotation lottery tickets, bullpen fodder, and utility men. Every team probably has a couple of big name signings that have worked well.

The two absolute misses on the list that bother me are Keppinger and LaRoche.

All that said, FA signings are one facet of a GM's game. Let's see how the draft picks pan out over the next few years- Madrigal, Collins, Burdi. Let's see how the trades work out- Eloy, Cease, Rutherford. Let's see how the international signings develop - Robert, Adolfo.

You can't throw Hahn totally under the bus based on that list, as awful as it looks. Take context into account.
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  #13  
Old 04-21-2019, 07:30 PM
LITTLE NELL LITTLE NELL is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian26 View Post
Just trying to be level-headed about that list, because it looks awful, but some things to point out:

Many of the names on the list were signed for relative peanuts (in MLB terms at least).

The big names that have been signed generally performed admirably. Abreu, you could argue, was worth well more than what he signed for and probably has been worth about twice for what he actually signed for (which would be close to half of that $250M). Robertson and Melky did fine, and Rutherford might end up worth the eventual trade of Robertson and Frazier.

The biggest point though is to consider league-wide free agent signings aren't as prolific as they once were. Many talented players are signed and extended early. I don't feel like doing the homework now, but I would guess if you were to look at a list of FA signings for every team in baseball, the lists would look similar: 90% filler with back of the rotation lottery tickets, bullpen fodder, and utility men. Every team probably has a couple of big name signings that have worked well.

The two absolute misses on the list that bother me are Keppinger and LaRoche.

All that said, FA signings are one facet of a GM's game. Let's see how the draft picks pan out over the next few years- Madrigal, Collins, Burdi. Let's see how the trades work out- Eloy, Cease, Rutherford. Let's see how the international signings develop - Robert, Adolfo.

You can't throw Hahn totally under the bus based on that list, as awful as it looks. Take context into account.
There were a few good ones like Abreu, Melky and Robertson and Frazier but the rest of the list negates the good FA pickups. In my book Hahn can make up for that list with the acquisitions he's made in the rebuild, Moncada, Cease, Eloy, Kopech, Robert, Madrigal and Basabe should all be All Star caliber players, I'm not sure about Lopez and Giolito, hopefully they will.
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  #14  
Old 04-21-2019, 07:50 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LITTLE NELL View Post
There were a few good ones like Abreu, Melky and Robertson and Frazier but the rest of the list negates the good FA pickups. In my book Hahn can make up for that list with the acquisitions he's made in the rebuild, Moncada, Cease, Eloy, Kopech, Robert, Madrigal and Basabe should all be All Star caliber players, I'm not sure about Lopez and Giolito, hopefully they will.
Frazier was acquired in a trade not as a free agent. If I have some time I'll try to put together a list of players Hahn has acquired in trade. My gut tells me it is light years better than his free agent manipulations.

The downside to a trade? You have to give up something to get something from a player standpoint and the Sox don't have talent / players to spare.

Brian's points being considered over 250 million dollars spent on these guys in total, given the return seems like a huge waste of money that maybe (notice I said maybe) could have been better spent.
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  #15  
Old 04-21-2019, 08:29 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Originally Posted by LoveYourSuit View Post
For the sake of keeping Eloy in one piece, the Sox better find a way to vacate DH ASAP or else this guy is going to get hurt in the OF and ruin whatever offensive career was projected on him.



Its beyond being a butcher, he will get hurt out there. He played over 400 games in the OF in the minors and he looks like this is the first time hes been out there.


Seeing major league pitching I get but playing the outfield in the minors and majors cant be much different.
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