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  #16  
Old 05-30-2013, 04:52 PM
sox1970 sox1970 is online now
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Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
JR is responsible for who he employs. And it is clear he values loyalty over performance excellence. That is the problem.

I don't fault this organization's pitching philosophy.

But their ability to draft, develop and coach position players is abysmal.
Cannot be said any better.
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  #17  
Old 05-30-2013, 04:58 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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Against two of the worst teams in baseball the Sox score 17 runs in six games.

That's bad even by their low standards.

13th in the league in hitting, dead last in the league in fielding.

7th time in the last 10 games they've scored three runs or less.

I understand this brain dead bunch doesn't give Robin a lot of room to change things but at least try to do something, even if it means putting names into a hat and drawing them out for the batting order. Billy Martin did that from time to time.

Jones and Omogrosso come into the game and promptly give up runs. So what else is new? Yet they're still on the big league roster.

Lip

Last edited by Lip Man 1; 05-30-2013 at 05:05 PM.
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  #18  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:01 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
JR is responsible for who he employs. And it is clear he values loyalty over performance excellence. That is the problem.

I don't fault this organization's pitching philosophy.

But their ability to draft, develop and coach position players is abysmal.
Well it's part of the problem, how much depends of whom you speak to.

I was just told a few days ago with the draft coming up that JR continues to 'suggest' to his scouting people that drafting college pitchers are "a safer bet..."

The man owns the team, he can do what he wishes, but I'd think he understands that it's counter productive to hire people who supposedly know what they are doing then try to step in and ask them to do something else that they might not want to do.

Lip
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  #19  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:02 PM
Crestani Crestani is offline
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Originally Posted by Brian26 View Post
The ownership witchhunt is tired. They have invested enough money to win. JR isnt the problem. The problem is with personnel on the field and the talent evaluators.

X2...I would bet Reinsdorf feels preety much like we do. His biggest problem is loyalty, which is not deserved..!!
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  #20  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:12 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Originally Posted by Brian26 View Post
The ownership witchhunt is tired. They have invested enough money to win. JR isnt the problem. The problem is with personnel on the field and the talent evaluators.
Seriously, the Sox have one of the better payrolls in baseball, one of the few guys around this outfit whose pulling his weight is JR.
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  #21  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:14 PM
VeeckAsInWreck VeeckAsInWreck is offline
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This team is frustrating to watch. They can look good against good teams like Boston and Anaheim and then play like complete garbage against the Cubs.
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  #22  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:16 PM
russ99 russ99 is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Seriously, the Sox have one of the better payrolls in baseball, one of the few guys around this outfit whose pulling his weight is JR.
The problem isn't the total payroll number, it's that a little extra cash spent in January goes a long way.

That the ownership continually attempts to hold to the idea of not fielding a complete team as a carrot to get fans to buy tickets and "spend in midseason" is ridiculous. Winning is the only thing that fills the park. You'd think JR would have figured that out by now.

2005, 2006 and 2010 are the only exceptions in recent memory.
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  #23  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by LITTLE NELL View Post
It's bad but I remember a series in 07 against the Twins that was way more embarrassing, one against the Red Sox in I think 09 was another one.
That being said It's time for a shakeup, it's time for some kind of rebuild, when all we did was sign Keppinger in the off-season I just scratched my head and said to myself what does the brain trust have in mind.
The plan is obvious; Hahn is waiting out some of the larger deals on the books he inherited to expire before he starts rebuilding the roster. The Sox have something like $70 million of salaries coming off their payroll in 2013 and 2014. That's clearly what the plan is.

Doesn't do the team any good to start some half assed rebuild without any resources.
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  #24  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by russ99 View Post
You'd think JR would have figured that out by now.
Oh come on, don't be so naive, the Sox are making crazy amounts of money, their most likely cooked accounting books shows a profit of tens of millions of dollars, you think he's holding on to the Sox for the pride? No, it's because it's a cash cow.
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  #25  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:21 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Oh come on, don't be so naive, the Sox are making crazy amounts of money, their most likely cooked accounting books shows a profit of tens of millions of dollars, you think he's holding on to the Sox for the pride? No, it's because it's a cash cow.
I agree with that comment.

Lip
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  #26  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:40 PM
SoxSpeed22 SoxSpeed22 is online now
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Sums up my thoughts pretty well...
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  #27  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:44 PM
ChiSoxFann ChiSoxFann is offline
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Well that was an awful game to be at. I picked up some cheapies on stubhub and regret taking the day off.

We snuck out in the 7th to head to the train. The Travis Wood grand slam, Viciedo's belly flop and the missed infield pop up we're bad, but DeAza get thrown out at 2nd when we're down 5 was the play where we decided to get out of there. Awful baseball
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  #28  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:51 PM
BainesHOF BainesHOF is offline
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Originally Posted by skobabe8 View Post
If this helps convince Hahn, KW, etc. to break this thing down and build it up, GOOD.
I agree. Hahn needs to make 100 percent of the decisions, though. Williams should have zero imput. In fact, he shouldn't even be in the organization. Hahn should not have to worry that Williams is looking over his shoulder whether that's real or imagined.

One of the first things Hahn needs to do is dump Williams' manager and find a real one who knows what he's doing.
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  #29  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:58 PM
SoxSpeed22 SoxSpeed22 is online now
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Originally Posted by Brian26 View Post
The ownership witchhunt is tired. They have invested enough money to win. JR isnt the problem. The problem is with personnel on the field and the talent evaluators.
I don't think JR is the biggest problem. He has spent the money, but did he put it in the right places? He put up the money to get the players, but those players haven't been worth the investment. I'll let them off for Peavy since he had a bad injury. Rios has been up and down, a lot of those big contracts haven't gotten it done. Constantly spending none of that money on the draft or international players has also hurt them in the long run. Lastly, not having much invested in scouts or coaches also contributed to this wreck.
I'm, all for new voices in the organization.
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  #30  
Old 05-30-2013, 06:02 PM
nsolo nsolo is offline
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Originally Posted by BainesHOF View Post
I agree. Hahn needs to make 100 percent of the decisions, though. Williams should have zero imput. In fact, he shouldn't even be in the organization. Hahn should not have to worry that Williams is looking over his shoulder whether that's real or imagined.

One of the first things Hahn needs to do is dump Williams' manager and find a real one who knows what he's doing.
I wouldn't know who that would be. Any major league caliber manager worth his salt wouldn't want to take of this team without HUGE pay. JR would not want to pay. That's why we've had the past string of managers, they were cheap.
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