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Old 08-03-2013, 11:02 AM
harwar harwar is offline
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I expected 5-10 below 500 .. i sure didn't see this coming..
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Old 08-03-2013, 11:08 AM
SoxSpeed22 SoxSpeed22 is offline
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I also had them pegged for less than 90 losses. The biggest problem I didn't expect was the overall drop-off defensively. There were obvious holes going into the season, so I didn't think they would win 90, but I didn't think they would (likely) lose 100+.
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Old 08-03-2013, 11:39 AM
hawkjt hawkjt is offline
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I was hopeful for a winning season.

The offense and defense was respectable last year for most of the season.
No reason to expect them to fall apart,but they did.
PK hit .400 the first two months last year,and had decent numbers,even with the injuries.....this year..nothing.

AJ's offense is sorely missed.
Keppinger has been a disaster.
They lose a ton of close games...playing just good enough to barely lose.
They are now losing out of habit.
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Old 08-03-2013, 12:13 PM
white sox bill white sox bill is offline
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I was expecting .500 to a few games under 500. Certainly not the bottom feeders of the AL
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Old 08-03-2013, 12:26 PM
BigKlu59 BigKlu59 is offline
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Originally Posted by hawkjt View Post
I was hopeful for a winning season.

The offense and defense was respectable last year for most of the season.
No reason to expect them to fall apart,but they did.
PK hit .400 the first two months last year,and had decent numbers,even with the injuries.....this year..nothing.

AJ's offense is sorely missed.
Keppinger has been a disaster.
They lose a ton of close games...playing just good enough to barely lose.
They are now losing out of habit.
Canvas started out as all Pale Hose teams, the dreaded mediocre .500 minimum with wishes of picking up 15-20 W's to remain a competative squad... I didnt see this iceberg vs Titanic coming.. As had been said, the pitching really hasnt sucked, they just can win the close ones for the life of them. Of course if they could catch the damn ball or hit the damn ball we wouldnt be lamenting those close ones.. Agree... There was a leadership vacuum after AJ left. His hits and "tude" are obviously missing from this team..

68 as Nell says was a, Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?.. just based on the longevity of the teams competative nature. 13 falls under more of a you gotta be ****ing kidding me,... observation.. never expected the apples to rot in the basket all at the same time and same pace...

This kinda slop belongs on the North Side of town..They have been acclimated to it...

Big Klu says... "When you step in the box you go to war"..
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Old 08-03-2013, 12:54 PM
fungo bat fungo bat is offline
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Originally Posted by LITTLE NELL View Post
Before the season I thought the Sox were going to win about 84 games. With Keppinger our only pick-up and letting AJ walk I didn't see us giving Detroit a run for the division. Never in my worst nightmares did I see a train wreck of massive proportions like we are seeing with this team, did anyone see this coming. I'd like to compare this to the 67-68 seasons when in 67 we led the AL for most of the season and lost 5 games in a row to the 2 worst teams in the last week, much like last years meltdown. In 68 the team fell from one of the best to one of the worst much like this year, same thing then, no one saw it coming. In some respects 68 was a bigger shocker because the White Sox were always contenders with 17 straight winning seasons and some like me had never seen a White Sox losing season.
I recall '67 and the fallout from '68. I don't think anyone saw that coming, either. Like this year's team, those Sox teams couldn't hit. But they had excellent pitching and defense. The wheels fell off in '68 when they started the season by losing the first 10 games. Stanky paid the price and was gone by mid-season. Like this year's team, they got old quick and there was nothing on the farm to fill the void.

I figured the Sox for 78 wins this year. I thought they would be competitive. Watching this year's team is absolute agony. They are disgraceful.

So much for blaming Guillen, or Walker. The real fault lies with the front office, specifically Williams. There are many other factors, of course, including overrating some of the talent currently on the roster. Hahn now has a lot of work to do to get the Sox back on track.

Somehow Williams got himself kicked upstairs. Granted, he made some good moves over the years. And he deserves partial credit for the championship of 2005. But for every good move he's made, he's made plenty of bad decisions. This year's debacle can be traced back to Williams depleting the farm system over the years in an attempt to keep the Sox consistently competitive vs. shifting into a rebuilding mode. The Sox are now paying the price for this decision.

It's hard to believe we're 27 games under .500. But when you don't hit, don't run the bases very well, don't field, and are fundamentally poor you are going to lose more than you win.

I still think the Sox have a decent core of young pitching to build around. That means they may be able to turn this thing around quicker than normal. Let's hope so. It's been a depressing season on the south side.

Last edited by fungo bat; 08-03-2013 at 01:03 PM.
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Old 08-03-2013, 12:57 PM
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JB98 JB98 is offline
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I didn't think it would get this bad, no, because of the starting pitching that is in place. Even during this horrible losing streak, the starting pitchers have posted a 2.68 ERA. That's good enough to be .500, even if your position players and relief pitchers are bad. Unfortunately, the position players on this team are just hopeless.

If you would have told me before the season things are going to go wrong and they'll lose between 85 and 90, yeah, I could have believed that. But never in my worst nightmares did I expect to be staring down a 100-loss season.
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Old 08-03-2013, 01:58 PM
WhiteSox5187 WhiteSox5187 is offline
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I thought that at best this team would win 83 games and at worst would lose somewhere around 90. I never thought that they would be THIS bad. They could lose 100.

Go Sox!!!
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Old 08-03-2013, 02:20 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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I didnt expect them to be good and it was a possibility that they could be this bad. I remember the late 60's and 1970, the Sox had good starting staffs but their record was really bad. You can have a good starting staff and have a horrible record.
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Old 08-03-2013, 02:34 PM
KyWhiSoxFan KyWhiSoxFan is offline
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Originally Posted by DumpJerry View Post
Where do we rank in save opportunities? Since we seem to score only one or two runs a game, I/m thinking there have not been as many as most other teams.
The Sox are 10th of 15 AL teams in saves, with 26. They are right in the middle, 8th, in overall ERA (3.98) of all AL teams.

Interestingly, the team with the lowest number of saves is the BoSox with 21. Highest is Baltimore with 42.

And the team with lowest ERA is KC (3.62).
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Old 08-03-2013, 03:10 PM
StillMissOzzie StillMissOzzie is offline
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It was apparent that the offense was going to be worse than last year, but I don't know how anyone could have seen the decline in defense. IIRC, I had this team at 86-76, and not really contending, but at least interesting enough to watch. Now, I don't even watch unless there is nothing better to do.

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Old 08-03-2013, 03:30 PM
Red Barchetta Red Barchetta is offline
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The last two seasons have been the most frustrating seasons to watch in my life.

First, I have always liked Robin Ventura as a player and a person. However, like many, I was skeptical that he could be an effective manager. Mostly because I had never, ever, read about his desire to become a manager. It was almost like the SOX chose him as a good company man and then made up the story about how Ventura approached the SOX.

Second, it seemed as though Ventura and the rest of the team were surprised on how well they played last season. They carried themselves all season as a team that was going to beat themselves and eventually surrender the division to the Tigers because 2012 was supposed to be a "rebuilding year". For a team that was in first place for a large part of the season, they didn't act like it or have the aura of confidence most first place teams have.

Lastly, I think that same mental attitude carried itself over into the 2013 season. If you take into account the last month of the 2012 season, the 2013 White Sox are pretty much the same team both in on-field performance and mental approach.
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Old 08-03-2013, 04:16 PM
captain54 captain54 is offline
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the collapse in 2012 in down the stretch exposed the team for what it was.. a no hitting/relying on homers bunch of stiffs... I will never understand what they were thinking making Flowers the everyday and letting AJ go..

what hasnt been mentioned is how the rest of the division, with the exception of Minnesota, got better..

To say if anyone say anything coming in sports in general is kind of silly.. even if you are betting, you are just playing percentages. its not an exact science..

I hope fans understand the historic magnitude of what is happening here... this organization has been exposed down to its bare bones..There are serious problems at every level.. This is not just a bad season, this is a monumental collapse on all levels.. and the blame goes straight to the Ivory Tower at 35th and Shields.. I for one do not have one ounce of faith that simply changing the personnel on the field or the manager is gonna fix this situation.
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Old 08-03-2013, 04:45 PM
TDog TDog is offline
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Originally Posted by SCCWS View Post
Actually the White Sox are tied for 4th with the least blown saves in the AL.
That's a deceptive statistic. Twice this year, the White Sox have scored five runs in an inning to take the lead, and on both occasions, the opposition came back to score five runs in the next half inning. The only other five-run inning I recall the Sox having this year only made the game close, but in that game the Angels came up with four in the next half inning to put the game out of reach. It isn't just about the Sox not scoring runs to support great pitching. The season has been a series of key pitching mistakes that have lost close games. Even Chris Sale has lost games where he had the lead because he made key mistakes. In a home game against the A's, he had a 3-0 lead in the fifth and gave up a grand slam after walking a hitter to load the bases.

One reason comparing the Sox bullpen to others around baseball is deceptive is that for the Sox, the bullpen was supposed to be a strength, especially with the addition of Lindstrom. But it wasn't just the bullpen. The hitting was expected to be better. Keppinger looked like he was going to be the No. 2 hitter to hit behind a good leadoff man in front of a healthy Konerko and a Dunn that was going to keep coming back. Beckham looked like he was going to be the hitter he showed promise to be as a rookie he providing strong defense up the middle with Ramirez. Despite Beckham having a good year offensively, he was lost after the first homestand and none of that stuff panned out.

Of course no one saw this coming. People who claim to have seen this coming are gloating over their fulfilled worst-case-scenario dreams for White Sox baseball. Everything has gone wrong this season, and the Sox have still managed to win games where thing have gone horribly wrong.

This isn't unlike 1968. I turned 13 in 1970, and this is the White Sox of my teens, with the exception of 1972. Even in 1977, the White Sox won a lot of games playing really bad baseball. There have comparisons made to 1970, but this team is really 1976 when there seemed a little promise early or 1973 because of the injuries. Really, this is what watching White Sox baseball was like in the 1970s.

And the reasons aren't so dissimilar. The Sox fell apart at the end of the 1960s because they traded most of their best young players and prospects (Don Buford and Tommy Agee were opposing outfielders in the 1969 World Series) for stopgap veterans to maintain a team that could play above .500. The White Sox finished the 1960s with a thin farm system. The top slugger in the system in 1971 was Ken Hottman hitting 37 home runs in Tucson, and there is a reason even Bill Melton didn't remember him when I asked him if he did.

This is what White Sox baseball was like before the Reinsdorf group bought the team. The difference now is that the White Sox have a foundation in pitching. Personnel rules should allow the Sox to get better sooner. Also, I think there are some players that are having the antithesis of the career year.
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Old 08-04-2013, 08:30 PM
Hitmen77 Hitmen77 is offline
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I doubt most people saw a team this bad coming. I was expecting something like 79 wins.

That being said, I have seen the Sox slide to becoming a lousy team (not this bad, though) for a few years now. The inability to develop talent within the organization (either to fill holes on our team or to trade for other talent) is at the core of this train wreck and that's been many years in the making.
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